Allowing and ignoring lawlessness, rampant drug dealing, and homelessness in Los Angeles is working out fine.

grapedrink

Duke status
May 21, 2011
26,199
14,975
113
A Beach
No, I don't,
That's what I thought, thanks for proving my point.

but forcing people to relocate is not a good idea.
It wouldn't be forced, you just aren't allowed to sleep in public at night. Or do things like block sidewalks, parking spots, etc that are supposed to be for the public to share with equal access. That really shouldn't be controversial.

It's a hard problem to solve.
Agreed.
 

PRCD

Tom Curren status
Feb 25, 2020
12,806
8,825
113
That's what I thought, thanks for proving my point.


It wouldn't be forced, you just aren't allowed to sleep in public at night. Or do things like block sidewalks, parking spots, etc that are supposed to be for the public to share with equal access. That really shouldn't be controversial.


Agreed.
Watch "Seattle is Dying." Unless there's a plan to force them into drug rehab after an arrest/conviction, there is no plan (there is no plan).
 
  • Like
Reactions: grapedrink

VonMeister

Duke status
Apr 26, 2013
20,251
6,977
113
JOE BIDENS RAPE FINGER
No, I don't, but forcing people to relocate is not a good idea. It's a hard problem to solve.
What's so hard abut enforcing the laws as written? When you do that people tend to respond. Some go home, some seek treatment, some reconnect with family etc etc. It's the best and most efficient way to start. Follow behind with treatment and wrap around services. Right now they are leading with service and not providing any incentives. It's a comfortable free for all and it's just making things worse.
 

VonMeister

Duke status
Apr 26, 2013
20,251
6,977
113
JOE BIDENS RAPE FINGER
Watch "Seattle is Dying." Unless there's a plan to force them into drug rehab after an arrest/conviction, there is no plan (there is no plan).
We did away with 11550 decades ago and this is part of the result of that.

It's important not to confuse people with the problem. If there's people that need help..so be it. Personally I don't believe it's the governments responsibility to mop up after a series of bad choices but there's adequate private charities and government services already available for that.

On the other hand the civic responsibility is to enforce the laws and maintain order. This has nothing to do with who or how many homeless there are or the root cause. When you keep homeless moving they tend to move away. If California did away with the tent cities via enforcing local ordinances you would see the problem begin to clear itself up over night.
 

kidfury

Duke status
Oct 14, 2017
25,024
10,770
113
What's so hard abut enforcing the laws as written? When you do that people tend to respond. Some go home, some seek treatment, some reconnect with family etc etc. It's the best and most efficient way to start. Follow behind with treatment and wrap around services. Right now they are leading with service and not providing any incentives. It's a comfortable free for all and it's just making things worse.
Who does this kind of homelesness interference work? Do they like it? How much do they get paid? Who pays them? Good benefits?
 

grapedrink

Duke status
May 21, 2011
26,199
14,975
113
A Beach
?

How did I not having an answer prove a point? And what point do you mistakenly think was proven?
The fact that you don't have a better solution to an idea that you find unpalatable. What we are doing so is clearly not working and only getting worse.
 

PRCD

Tom Curren status
Feb 25, 2020
12,806
8,825
113
We did away with 11550 decades ago and this is part of the result of that.

It's important not to confuse people with the problem. If there's people that need help..so be it. Personally I don't believe it's the governments responsibility to mop up after a series of bad choices but there's adequate private charities and government services already available for that.

On the other hand the civic responsibility is to enforce the laws and maintain order. This has nothing to do with who or how many homeless there are or the root cause. When you keep homeless moving they tend to move away. If California did away with the tent cities via enforcing local ordinances you would see the problem begin to clear itself up over night.
There's a reason they're not doing that. They blame the 9th circuit court decision but we have no idea what went on through back channels and whether the 9th circuit gave these politicians and homeless industrial complex the decision they wanted.

Anyways, rest assured there's big money behind keeping the problem going.
 

$kully

Duke status
Feb 27, 2009
60,281
17,082
113
This opened up down the hill from me not too long ago…


I drive by it all the time. The fencing, white structures and bright security lights give it a bit of a concentration camp or prison vibe. But on closer inspection the art and colorful paint jobs of the “houses” give it a bit of character. Our homeless problems in the area haven’t all been miraculously been solved since it’s been opened but they also don’t seem any worse. I know some worried it would attract more transients to the area. I guess only time will tell if it’s a success or not, but it’s good to see a tangible attempt at addressing the problem.
 

Surfdog

Duke status
Apr 22, 2001
21,768
1,988
113
South coast OR
Constitutional rights be dammed!
Remember when we had a thing called vagrancy laws?

If you're a vagrant AND commit a crime, you go to jail or a mental institution.

Don't do the crime, if you can't do the time.

Simple as that.

Homeless shelters for those truly down on their luck, but drug/alcohol free.
If you stay longer than a few weeks or couple months, you need to earn your keep doing community service.

Do excessive drugs or alcohol? (getting $$$ somewhere for habit, usually crime) Send to rehab shelters that you can't leave until clean.

How can that be unconstitutional?

Letting homeless have free run of the streets and cities make as much sense as vegan steak sauce (yes there is such a thing).
 

Autoprax

Duke status
Jan 24, 2011
68,683
23,339
113
62
Vagina Point
Didn't NY have a crime wave in the 70s?

Aren't these things cyclical?

It really helps the pendulum swing the other way when the homeless people kill pretty white girls.

White murder privilege.

Same with rich white people dying of cholera from the homeless poop
 

afoaf

Duke status
Jun 25, 2008
49,631
23,248
113
it's funny to read this seeing as how people don't seem to grasp the fact that the supreme court has ruled that police cannot arrest people for sleeping on the sidewalk or upon other public property under most conditions

there's a reason why this has proliferated the way it has over the past couple of years and always on public right of ways.

consider this the bad with the constitutional good
 
  • Like
Reactions: $kully

StuAzole

Duke status
Jan 22, 2016
28,562
9,804
113
Is there a problem with that? In my plan you would be welcome to walk the streets all you want, you just can't camp out on them. You are also allowed to come and go as you you please. You would also have a choice- sleep in a designated zone, or a shelter, or a jail.

Do you have a better idea? :unsure:
Which law makes being homeless a crime?
How much does this plan cost? Where is this extra jail space you’ll need to house homeless every evening? What time are homeless asked to leave the jail each day and what time do they return? Can they sleep at different jails or are they restricted to just one? Do they get meals like other prisoners? Do they get irange jumpsuits? What about homeLes’s families? Same cell or separated? Kids in jail? Will there be on-site education?
 

VonMeister

Duke status
Apr 26, 2013
20,251
6,977
113
JOE BIDENS RAPE FINGER
This opened up down the hill from me not too long ago…


I drive by it all the time. The fencing, white structures and bright security lights give it a bit of a concentration camp or prison vibe. But on closer inspection the art and colorful paint jobs of the “houses” give it a bit of character. Our homeless problems in the area haven’t all been miraculously been solved since it’s been opened but they also don’t seem any worse. I know some worried it would attract more transients to the area. I guess only time will tell if it’s a success or not, but it’s good to see a tangible attempt at addressing the problem.
A couple dozen plywood homes that cost the state more than a single family home in the area EACH. Those little villages are a criminal enterprise designed to make you feel better (check).
 
  • Haha
Reactions: $kully

VonMeister

Duke status
Apr 26, 2013
20,251
6,977
113
JOE BIDENS RAPE FINGER
Which law makes being homeless a crime?
How much does this plan cost? Where is this extra jail space you’ll need to house homeless every evening? What time are homeless asked to leave the jail each day and what time do they return? Can they sleep at different jails or are they restricted to just one? Do they get meals like other prisoners? Do they get irange jumpsuits? What about homeLes’s families? Same cell or separated? Kids in jail? Will there be on-site education?
There are plenty of loitering and camping laws on the books....as well as laws against standing in traffic screaming, public nudity, public intoxication, assault, pimping and pandering, theft, drug dealing and public use, arson, urination and deification...not to mention the parking statues that are broken daily.
 
  • Like
Reactions: grapedrink

PRCD

Tom Curren status
Feb 25, 2020
12,806
8,825
113
A couple dozen plywood homes that cost the state more than a single family home in the area EACH. Those little villages are a criminal enterprise designed to make you feel better (check).
Most of these nonprofits are a jobs program for the children of the rich and a money laundering and benefactor program for the rich. If you look at how much they spend for each of those tiny homes, it's astronomical. Voters continue to support this approach because many of their kids are addicted to drugs (one woman in my former town admitted she just wanted a safe space for her daughter to do drugs) and because they ask politicians to DO SOMETHING, housing the homeless is something, therefore house the homeless.

I watched a SFH be purchased for 200% of ask in a family neighborhood. The nonprofit that purchased it was going to convert it into a flophouse for 18-26 year olds who had no history of violence in the past six months. :ROFLMAO: The realtors made a killing, the nonprofit controlled the resource and got $20k a month rent directly from the government.
 

afoaf

Duke status
Jun 25, 2008
49,631
23,248
113
There are plenty of loitering and camping laws on the books....as well as laws against standing in traffic screaming, public nudity, public intoxication, assault, pimping and pandering, theft, drug dealing and public use, arson, urination and deification...not to mention the parking statues that are broken daily.
ticketing and arrest for a mentally ill vagrant is a losing proposition

we need new (legal) tools...it does not appear that the courts are going to grant them, however