Endtimes for the Surfboard Industry?

[TeamScam]

They have a different resonant frequency - that's how I measured the flex.

Me too! When I was a better younger surfer sometimes I'd get really pissed at myself blowing rides all day and eventually if not too many people around I would punch the nose while sitting on the board. I hoped to knock the nose clean off, but it would just sit there vibrating at my uncoolness. Doing so I noticed related resonance and tried to judge a few boards by their vibration factor.
I figured if a board had a duller this, it had too much flex and or less potential tenacity if you will, however over the years, definitely had good boards with a full thud reaction.

I've always felt flex in positive ways, when applicable.
I do think the average surfer, and even board conesiuer afficiendo types are tripping little more than they realize over especially minute fin details. Not saying it's no big deal, or that people can't discern different fins, just that I think there are many listening and paying attention to fins, board builds, leash strings etc, that I've seen surf and they have no clue what a good archer do yet they go all in on the arrow feathers contemplation.
It's a good thing anyway.

 

[coquearaujo]

If the flex theory of surfboards had any legs it would not have died out everywhere else than on surfboard forums.

But fine by me, take your 2mm of surfboard bending, call it flex and live in the belief it makes you surf better.


This is so messed up, I don't want to be on Team Flex, even if I am wrong.

You must be kidding. I know LOTS of surfers who tried to ride sandwich epoxy boards and they didn't like them so had to go back into riding short lasting PU/PE boards. By LOTS I mean: friends, customers, surfers I train, pro surfers...

So, since you can't feel it, all of us are wrong.

BTW you don't need to be a pro surfer to feel that, some surfers are just more sensitive gear wise.

On the original topic: lots of surfboard brands are struggling with the low sales and flex makes no difference here: from JS to Firewire, almost everyone is struggling in 2023.

Nothing to add here.

 

[Mr J]

...
On the original topic: lots of surfboard brands are struggling with the low sales and flex makes no difference here: from JS to Firewire, almost everyone is struggling in 2023.

Nothing to add here.

Low sales the main reason? Historically low sales, or just a return to pre-covid sales. Any other reasons they are struggling?such as more manufacturers entered the market? High interest rates in Australia are said to be hurting retail in general.

 

[Duffy LaCoronilla]

Surfboards don’t flex…

 

[doc_flavonoid]

 

[Retropete]

You must be kidding. I know LOTS of surfers who tried to ride sandwich epoxy boards and they didn't like them so had to go back into riding short lasting PU/PE boards. By LOTS I mean: friends, customers, surfers I train, pro surfers...

Nice combo of an appeal to majority and authority fallacies in the one statement.
There's a plethora of clips online of surfers ripping the bag out of waves on "sandwich epoxy boards".
If the boards had no markings, logos. branding or a description of what's being ridden would be interesting to see if viewers could accurately pick these boards out from clips with pu boards being ridden with no markings, logos and so on?
If not then that goes back to the impressions of the rider and this has a whole lot to do with many other variables such as what board materials you are most used to, surface and wind conditions, wave power and shape, where you surf and also rider weight not just rider skill.
There's a plethora of different composite builds on the market and lumping them into a single description to discount them is a bit harsh. I've found plenty I love and plenty I don't gel with at all.

 

[Duffy LaCoronilla]

Nice combo of an appeal to majority and authority fallacies in the one statement.
There's a plethora of clips online of surfers ripping the bag out of waves on "sandwich epoxy boards".
If the boards had no markings, logos. branding or a description of what's being ridden would be interesting to see if viewers could accurately pick these boards out from clips with pu boards being ridden with no markings, logos and so on?
If not then that goes back to the impressions of the rider and this has a whole lot to do with many other variables such as what board materials you are most used to, surface and wind conditions, wave power and shape, where you surf and also rider weight not just rider skill.
There's a plethora of different composite builds on the market and lumping them into a single description to discount them is a bit harsh. I've found plenty I love and plenty I don't gel with at all.

I can see the difference when Kelly is on FireWires or is on a PU dressed like one.

 

[diegof_carpintero]

like it or not...
if you double the width of a beam........you double the stiffness
if you double the thickness of a beam.........you make it eight times stiffer
one of the best boards I have tried in hh waves was a pu/pe Surf Prescriptions Y2K model with a flat deck 1 3/4¨ thick......but didnt liked it with bigger waves.
I think the pu/pe build with a domed deck is like an I beam......it tends to twist more than flex.

 

[Retropete]

Beau has gone a shade of green and his new Varuna is "in a positive direction for the planet".
Still has Surfboard warehouse hawking 9 of his cheap Chinese made models.
Virtue signalling in the surfboard industry?
It's like when you got to the supermarket and get told you can't have a plastic bag, since they are being environmentally friendly, to carry all your items home that are packaged in plastic.

 

[GromsDad]

Low sales the main reason? Historically low sales, or just a return to pre-covid sales. Any other reasons they are struggling?such as more manufacturers entered the market? High interest rates in Australia are said to be hurting retail in general.

A lot of industries were on a sugar high during the Covid years. There will likely now be a contraction to below pre-covid levels for a lot of businesses especially for non-essential leisure products like surfboards.

 

[freeride76]

Big manufacturers will feel that most- smaller operations with loyal custom clientele, not so much.

Inventory is expensive.

 

[Mr J]

...
There's a plethora of clips online of surfers ripping the bag out of waves on "sandwich epoxy boards".
...

really? sandwich build as in a lam consisting of glass on foam, then the sandwich core - usually divinicell or wood (although the short lived tuflite2 used polymethacrylimide (eg brand Rohacell and that's what I suspect varial is). The only significant manufacturers of sandwich are surftech and firewire. Only N Shores and myself like tuflite, so that leaves firewire which does have some pros. Michel Bourez was looking really good on his firewire at Bells a few years back - according to Marc Price that wasn't a full sandwich build - the deck was, but the bottom was a single fibreglass skin if I remember correctly - that combo made specially for his comp board. I wouldn't class this as smoke and mirrors, it is still sandwich on the deck and nothing like a PU/PE, also the pros PU/PEs are not like the ones sold to the man on the street.

I think for a short while CI was doing a build where the hull was sandwich and the deck single fibreglass.

Or are you talking about composite builds in general? In which case I think they do play with and probably enjoy those, but rarely if ever use them in competition. eg. Connor Coffin has enthused more than once on instagram about his JS hifyi and said he would use it in competition in the right conditions, but I don't think that ever happened.

 

[Retropete]

really? sandwich build as in a lam consisting of glass on foam, then the sandwich core - usually divinicell or wood (although the short lived tuflite2 used polymethacrylimide (eg brand Rohacell and that's what I suspect varial is). The only significant manufacturers of sandwich are surftech and firewire. Only N Shores and myself like tuflite, so that leaves firewire which does have some pros. Michel Bourez was looking really good on his firewire at Bells a few years back - according to Marc Price that wasn't a full sandwich build - the deck was, but the bottom was a single fibreglass skin if I remember correctly - that combo made specially for his comp board. I wouldn't class this as smoke and mirrors, it is still sandwich on the deck and nothing like a PU/PE, also the pros PU/PEs are not like the ones sold to the man on the street.

I think for a short while CI was doing a build where the hull was sandwich and the deck single fibreglass.

Or are you talking about composite builds in general? In which case I think they do play with and probably enjoy those, but rarely if ever use them in competition. eg. Connor Coffin has enthused more than once on instagram about his JS hifyi and said he would use it in competition in the right conditions, but I don't think that ever happened.

I took it as an umbrella term to mean eps/epoxy builds by old mate since he's championing pu/poly in the flex argument.
Strangely enough up popped this flex article...though its actually really breakage resistance rather than about active flex when surfing.

Aussie Board Builders Snap Foam In The Name Of Science

Stuart and Ryan Campbell don lab coats and proceed squash foam and fiberglass to test the strength of PU, epoxy and their signature Exo Flex.

stabmag.com

 

[freeride76]

also the pros PU/PEs are not like the ones sold to the man on the street.

They pretty much are- shaped PU blank laminated with fibreglass and PE (sometimes epoxy) resin.

Same as the man on the street gets.

You can get a pro weight glassed board from any board manufacturer in the world.

There's no special sauce for pros.

Lots of pros around here on sell their boards to rec surfers.

 

[Northern_Shores]

Only N Shores and myself like tuflite

The whole Surftech debacle shows how much cool-factor and marketing impacts surfing (and other similar sports/cultures).
Surftech makes great boards. Light and very durable. They lack in cool factor for whatever reason. Firewire manages to make finned barges while maintaining the cool factor. I have a Firewire Unibrow . It has no tail rocker, so it's fast, but any wave above 10 seconds interval and that POS won't hold a turn. They do have some awesome boards like the Cymatic, Seaside and others. By getting that Machado and Kelly cool, they are able to sell the 45L 5'10" models to the general public.

Edit:
Al Merrick convinced me it was a great idea to get a 43,3L 5'11" and he was right

 

[sdsrfr]

i always wondered if you can feel more in warm water vs cold.

i don’t think I’d notice a boards flex in 40F water, for example.

 

[Northern_Shores]

i always wondered if you can feel more in warm water vs cold.

i don’t think I’d notice a boards flex in 40F water, for example.

In 7mm boots, suit and gloves, you might as well ride a door. Which I do

 

[kidfury]

I surf a lot, been surfing a long time. Most surfers notice their boar's flex, but don't know that they're noticing it. Flex is for sure important, and if you don't have much, like with Tuflite, the boar feels different. Thunderbolt Red epoxy construction has flex and feels really good by comparison.

 

[sdsrfr]

In 7mm boots, suit and gloves, you might as well ride a door. Which I do

yep. any time I surf in sf compared to sd I chuckle at the 1/16” I’ve been scrutinizing for my SD daily drivers.

it’s not really the same sport after a certain temperature differential.

 

[EastCoastBrah]

I've surfed a bunch of polys and a bunch of epoxys designed to have extra flex. The flexy epoxys very obviously have more spring off the bottom, i always assumed that was the extra flex.