Hawaii- Done

[bluemarlin04]

Well, on the one hand opportunities are not limited by an enormous body of water, but on the other hand you’re far far less likely to be a victim of gang violence.

You realize that Hawaii is not Honolulu right?

And there is an inner city here with horrible gang violence.

 

[racer1]

No one minds how Washburn bastardizes Hawaiian traditional beliefs and legends like the Night Marchers?

Night marchers is the most tasty to bastardize

 

[bluemarlin04]

I don't get the 'it isn't my place to say' thing. Why not, you live in society like the rest of us. We can consider it for ourselves, assuming it means anything to us.

My interpretation of the Night Marchers is that it represents a brutally rigid caste system, but also a system that has qualities which our modern life may be lacking, namely sustainability and perhaps meaning. The idea of a rigid caste system is appalling to me, and yet for all I know it may be the only way people can live sustainably, at least until we've developed further, if we have time to develop further. Also I'm sure that a religious system of meaning can bind a community in shared values and purpose. I can see value in it despite it being so alien. I can see how others may value it, just as it is, being part of their life.

It's not good enough for Washburn though, who rewrites traditional beliefs and inserts his modern egalitarian values to accommodate a haole audience. If no one cares it only means that no one finds the traditional beliefs meaningful. God is dead, as it were.

Huh?

How does night marchers represent a brutally rigid caste system?

 

[estreet]

You realize that Hawaii is not Honolulu right?

???

And there is an inner city here with horrible gang violence.

I did my homework, Tech, doesn't compare to mainland inner cities.

 

[bluemarlin04]

???


I did my homework, Tech, doesn't compare to mainland inner cities.

It is still bad.

 

[racer1]

I wish we would 5x property taxes.

 

[estreet]

Huh?

How does night marchers represent a brutally rigid caste system?

Death for merely looking at them, even members of Congress aren’t that elitist.

 

[youcantbeserious]

I don't get the 'it isn't my place to say' thing. Why not, you live in society like the rest of us. We can consider it for ourselves, assuming it means anything to us.

My interpretation of the Night Marchers is that it represents a brutally rigid caste system, but also a system that has qualities which our modern life may be lacking, namely sustainability and perhaps meaning. The idea of a rigid caste system is appalling to me, and yet for all I know it may be the only way people can live sustainably, at least until we've developed further, if we have time to develop further. Also I'm sure that a religious system of meaning can bind a community in shared values and purpose. I can see value in it despite it being so alien. I can see how others may value it, just as it is, being part of their life.

It's not good enough for Washburn though, who rewrites traditional beliefs and inserts his modern egalitarian values to accommodate a haole audience. If no one cares it only means that no one finds the traditional beliefs meaningful. God is dead, as it were.

So what makes your interpretation of the Nigh Marchers more correct than his? And why is your interpretation something that should be "good enough" for Washburn, or anybody else?

If Hawaiians have an issue with the book, they are more than capable of chiming in, otherwise here we are, two maha'oi haoles, wala'au ana about what I don't know

 

[estreet]

So what makes your interpretation of the Nigh Marchers more correct than his?

I guess you have to be familiar with both the legend and the book.

 

[youcantbeserious]

I guess you have to be familiar with both the legend and the book.

I am very familiar with both. I can read and write Hawaiian. I have a Ph.D in history with an emphasis on Hawaii and the Pacific. Frankly I have been sitting here wondering what you're talking about, because your interpretation of Night Marchers folklore seems a little all over the place. Do you mind if I ask what sources you are using?

 

[bluemarlin04]

I am very familiar with both. I can read and write Hawaiian. I have a Ph.D in history with an emphasis on Hawaii and the Pacific. Frankly I have been sitting here wondering what you're talking about, because your interpretation of Night Marchers folklore seems a little all over the place. Do you mind if I ask what sources you are using?

Professors Stannard? Is that you?

You’re way too old to be on this site

 

[estreet]

You can't be serious, I understand that in the legend warriors are escorting a chief or Ali'i. With the exception of a relative of some kind, all commoners must lie face down and not look upon the marchers on penalty of death. If that's accurate enough, why would a half Hawaiian truck driver (not warrior or Ali'i) be allowed to join the march?

 

[bluemarlin04]

You can't be serious, I understand that in the legend warriors are escorting a chief or Ali'i. With the exception of a relative of some kind, all commoners must lie face down and not look upon the marchers on penalty of death. If that's accurate enough, why would a half Hawaiian truck driver (not warrior or Ali'i) be allowed to join the march?

I think you’re misunderstanding the legend of night marchers by a lot

Also- I not Hawaiian. I am Pacific Islander though.

I’m positive I saw night marchers on the big island when I was a kid

 

[youcantbeserious]

Professors Stannard? Is that you?

You’re way too old to be on this site

haha no, but David is a mentor of mine and a really great guy

 

[youcantbeserious]

You can't be serious, I understand that in the legend warriors are escorting a chief or Ali'i. With the exception of a relative of some kind, all commoners must lie face down and not look upon the marchers on penalty of death. If that's accurate enough, why would a half Hawaiian truck driver (not warrior or Ali'i) be allowed to join the march?

There are literally so many night marchers stories, passed on in families and communities, all of which create a body of folklore. It just seems like you are cherry picking some Wikipedia version to take issue with a work of fiction

 

[bluemarlin04]

haha no, but David is a mentor of mine and a really great guy

His work is pretty stellar. Had classes at Uh with one of his protégés. She was also really smart

 

[estreet]

There are literally so many night marchers stories, passed on in families and communities, all of which create a body of folklore. It just seems like you are cherry picking some Wikipedia version to take issue with a work of fiction

You seem to be claiming that Hawaiian myths were always just myths or stories that people retold and perhaps changed as it suited them and without any real moral, religious or spiritual meaning to them. They served as entertainment or to explain an inexplicable phenomena of some kind?

 

[Muscles]

I've heard so many different variations to night marchers. The stories used to scare me when I was a little kid. I could never fall asleep when camping. lol

 

[JSC]

Susanna Moore wrote a very good history of Hawai'i, despite the fact she is haole and not ethnic polynesian.

I don't remember if there is a lot about the Night Marchers though -

“Paradise of the Pacific, Ms. Moore’s new nonfiction book about Hawaii . . . provides a fascinating history of that Pacific archipelago . . . It is an elegantly written and conscientiously researched book.” ―Michiko Kakutani, The New York Times

https://www.amazon.com/Paradise-Pacific-Approaching-Susanna-Moore/dp/0374536171/ref=sr_1_7?dchild=1&keywords=susanna+moore&qid=1621147264&sr=8-7

 

[HarryLopez2]

As a kid/teenager, I never took manapu'a over the Pali. Just saying!

'Quick, eat it or throw it out the window.'