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Riot videos and reaction here
- Thread starter r32
- Start date
It's a highly perishable skill that degrades quickly when people are out of practice or never get past the introduction. Just like shooting. It can be maintained at a markedly higher level, but not for free.
Many of the various fire service agencies have their firefighters working out while on duty. That's not the case with the LE agencies.
I'm going to nominate this as the dumbest thing I've seen you say here
People have very unrealistic expectations about staffing, training, use-of-force, and other trade-offs.
If you want to staff police forces with tough, athletic guys who don't need guns and are good grapplers, you've just limited your applicant pool to only athletic men over a certain size. IOW, your potential applicants just fell by about 80% and it's already tough to find people who can meet the requirements.
Shooting is a highly-perishable skill. IOW, you must go to the range fairly often which is a training burden and expense.
Grappling is less perishable but takes longer to learn. Bigger grapplers need less training to control civilians, but bigger guys are rarer.
My friend is a captain of a police force. He's a small man who likes to run long distance and can't fight his way out of a paper bag. He gets everything done with verbal persuasion, which is another skill in itself that takes time to learn and doesn't always work with those on drugs. If he has to use physical abilities to control a suspect, he's SOL. That leaves the gun, which has much more permanent consequences.
All of the trade-offs above are serious to deal with and are mostly-peacetime assumptions. Throw in rioting and a population that naturally tries to fight with police and you end up with a lot of civilian deaths and outrage.
From what I'm hearing, we want calm guys who can calmly control suspects really well verbally but can seamlessly (and calmly!) shift to grappling or some sort of stun gun that needs to be invented. It takes a really good grappler to control you without hurting you. It takes a long time to get that good at grappling.
Good luck meeting those requirements. Maybe we need a dose of having to defend ourselves.
Sure thing, take a look at the records of gun/drug task forces, how many innocent people killed during no knock raids by swat? Your naivety is astounding.
ok
"Statistics
The number of no-knock raids has increased from 3,000 in 1981 to more than 50,000 in 2005, according to Peter Kraska, a criminologist at Eastern Kentucky University in Richmond.[4] Raids that lead to deaths of innocent people are increasingly common; since the early 1980s, forty bystanders have been killed, according to the Cato Institute in Washington, D.C.[4]
In Utah, no-knock warrants make up about 40% of all warrants served.[1] In Maryland, 90% of SWAT deployments were to serve search warrants, with two-thirds through forced entry.[1]
From 2010 through 2016, at least 81 civilians and 13 officers died during SWAT raids, including 31 civilians and eight officers during execution of no-knock warrants.[1] Half of the civilians killed were members of a minority.[1] Of those subject to SWAT search warrants, 42% are black and 12% are Hispanic.[1] Since 2011, at least seven federal lawsuits against officers executing no-knock warrants have been settled for over $1 million.[1]"
No-knock warrant - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
So if the data in wikipedia is accurate, that means from 2010 to 2016 there were around 350,000 no knock raids, during which 31 civilians died. So for that time period that averages out to 4.4 civilian deaths per year out of 50,000 raids per year.
I stand by my earlier nomination, but the day is young.
We have a police problem in this country, and I hope something good comes out of all this. Btw remember the white guy shot in the hotel by swat and the cops got off scot free. Also take a look at the brutality and corruption of the big city task forces, example Baltimore/NYCok
"Statistics
The number of no-knock raids has increased from 3,000 in 1981 to more than 50,000 in 2005, according to Peter Kraska, a criminologist at Eastern Kentucky University in Richmond.[4] Raids that lead to deaths of innocent people are increasingly common; since the early 1980s, forty bystanders have been killed, according to the Cato Institute in Washington, D.C.[4]
In Utah, no-knock warrants make up about 40% of all warrants served.[1] In Maryland, 90% of SWAT deployments were to serve search warrants, with two-thirds through forced entry.[1]
From 2010 through 2016, at least 81 civilians and 13 officers died during SWAT raids, including 31 civilians and eight officers during execution of no-knock warrants.[1] Half of the civilians killed were members of a minority.[1] Of those subject to SWAT search warrants, 42% are black and 12% are Hispanic.[1] Since 2011, at least seven federal lawsuits against officers executing no-knock warrants have been settled for over $1 million.[1]"
No-knock warrant - Wikipedia
So if the data in wikipedia is accurate, that means from 2010 to 2016 there were around 350,000 no knock raids, during which 31 civilians died. So for that time period that averages out to 4.4 civilian deaths per year out of 50,000 raids per year.
I stand by my earlier nomination, but the day is young.
I think what he was saying is that cop training mainly concentrates on the physical and gun training.
Not deescalation or how to handle mentally ill people.
Not dumb at all, he has a point.
That's why nothing changed since the Rodney King beating.
Cops are still trained to physically handle people for trivial offenses, to be overly physically aggressive or shoot first and ask questions later.
The cops who beat Rodney King all ended up as supervisors, does anyone see a problem here/
Pulling up in $300k Rolls Royce Cullinan to loot store in Soho.
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