Fires in Maui

Mr Doof

Duke status
Jan 23, 2002
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San Francisco, CA
NGOs like the Red Cross are just government cut-outs sponsored by USAID and other federal bureaucracies and - if we've learned anything from this incident - the government is not here to help.
FWIW, when some friends in the Lower Haight neighborhood of SF got burned out in the 90s, Red Cross was able to get them into temp housing a few hours later. Am sure the Maui situation is way, way worse than this was, but, for my friends and a lot of others, Red Cross did well then, and I like to believe they are doing what they can now.
 

Boneroni

Tom Curren status
Mar 5, 2012
12,114
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After watching those first person experience videos Pico posted, I was curious about the location and direcionality, so I looked on google maps, and their latest snapshot is after the fires. It's absolutely insane just how many structures are completely gone. Just mind blowing. :cry:
Screen Shot 2023-08-25 at 11.53.37 AM.pngScreen Shot 2023-08-25 at 11.53.50 AM.png
 

JSC

Nep status
Mar 11, 2008
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"Specifically, according to accounts of four people with knowledge of the situation, M. Kaleo Manuel, a Native Hawaiian cultural practitioner and DLNR’s deputy director for water resource management, initially balked at West Maui Land Co.’s requests for additional water to help prevent the fire from spreading to properties managed by the company"

More accounts of official incompetence - contributing to the death toll

https://www.civilbeat.org/2023/08/a-state-official-refused-to-release-water-for-west-maui-fires-until-it-was-too-late/?fbclid=IwAR21-ZRfn6HMbOs2ksypG3OCA7R9WnnHStXTqAw7IQqmdRUcBHs0-DekLs4
 
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hammies

Duke status
Apr 8, 2006
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"Specifically, according to accounts of four people with knowledge of the situation, M. Kaleo Manuel, a Native Hawaiian cultural practitioner and DLNR’s deputy director for water resource management, initially balked at West Maui Land Co.’s requests for additional water to help prevent the fire from spreading to properties managed by the company"

More accounts of official incompetence - contributing to the death toll

https://www.civilbeat.org/2023/08/a-state-official-refused-to-release-water-for-west-maui-fires-until-it-was-too-late/?fbclid=IwAR21-ZRfn6HMbOs2ksypG3OCA7R9WnnHStXTqAw7IQqmdRUcBHs0-DekLs4
 

Pico

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Aug 20, 2010
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West Maui Land Co are the biggest pieces of sh!t on the planet. Peter Martin and Co are fuckers and they are seeing this as a land grab. Its what they do. Not just West Maui. They are major backroom dealers in bypassing the permit system and pushing up land costs building homes for "Gentlemen Farmers". Fuck these guys. They stole Lanuipoko from the community and built their Shibai and they want their control to spread to Lahaina worse than fire. They hate Keeamoku Kapu.
 
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hammies

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Apr 8, 2006
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So today I read that they totaled up everybody whose whereabouts was confirmed and the list of missing people went for ~1000 to 388. Still horrible but a lot less horrible than 1000. Apparently the FBI are really good at keeping missing persons lists and came in and sort of took the reins of tracking down people.

Also I read that everyone in temporary shelters has now moved into hotels or Airbnbs, and they would be able to stay in their hotels and Airbnbs for at least 36 weeks, and the subsidies might be extended another 12 to 18 months.
 

$kully

Duke status
Feb 27, 2009
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So today I read that they totaled up everybody whose whereabouts was confirmed and the list of missing people went for ~1000 to 388. Still horrible but a lot less horrible than 1000. Apparently the FBI are really good at keeping missing persons lists and came in and sort of took the reins of tracking down people.

Also I read that everyone in temporary shelters has now moved into hotels or Airbnbs, and they would be able to stay in their hotels and Airbnbs for at least 36 weeks, and the subsidies might be extended another 12 to 18 months.
So people are getting more than $700?
 

LelandCuz

Billy Hamilton status
Mar 21, 2011
1,403
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Lahaina
So people are getting more than $700?
Well, they're getting put up in temporary housing on the West Side. How beneficial is that though? Kids will need to be bussed 1hr each way (not counting traffic or the frequent road closures) to the other side for school. Jobs are non-existant and will be for years. These people really need to leave the West Side or even the island for a couple years until rebuilding gets going. Encouraging people to stay and live in a temporary situation living off donated supplies isn't good for them. The government needs to start providing some forcasts about when hiuses will start being rebuilt and when jobs will return. Then people can make some better informed decisions about how to live their lives for the next few years. Right now they're living day to day and not really thinking big picture.

Where government money will really be needed is to cover all the uninsured renters and when rebuilding costs more than home owners insurance will cover.
 

Pico

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Aug 20, 2010
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2surf

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Apr 12, 2004
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www.allcare.com
I was shocked to read that as of 5 years ago 1 in 3 houses in Lahaina was a legal vacation rental. How does that play into the politics when the victims are largely landlords?
 

Pico

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Aug 20, 2010
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I was shocked to read that as of 5 years ago 1 in 3 houses in Lahaina was a legal vacation rental. How does that play into the politics when the victims are largely landlords?
It plays heavy into politics. Im very good friends with a couple of these "Landlords". Remember they made their money in the old town or their money is so vast they can afford to allow sentiments to influence their decisions. Maybe still waiting for the smoke to clear. The ones I know born and raised Lahaina and are heavily invested in the community. They have the Senators and Governors cell phone numbers. Then there is the otherside. Developers. The sides that see this as nothing more than an opportunity and they have already had meetings trying to pressure the county to bypass permitting rules. They are organized and moving fast.
 

LelandCuz

Billy Hamilton status
Mar 21, 2011
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Lahaina
I was shocked to read that as of 5 years ago 1 in 3 houses in Lahaina was a legal vacation rental. How does that play into the politics when the victims are largely landlords?
That doesn't seem possible. Of course some neighborboods have more vacation rentals but my neighborhood was 100% owner or long term renter occupied, with a few having a vacation rental ohana in the back yard. Lahaina Luna neighborhood the same, maybe without the occassional vacation rental ohana. I realize Baby Beach neighborhood had a lot of vacation rental condos but that's not enough to swing the statistic. If that statistic is true it's because all of the West Side is a Lahaina address so the "town" of Kapalua that is mostly vacation rentals and Kahana that has many count as "Lahaina" even though they are 8 miles from Lahaina town and not in the fire zone.
 

Kaser1

Tom Curren status
May 3, 2004
10,271
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Maine
I mostly enjoyed my 11 years living on Maui. But some of the cons of living there are being highlited now and it took a wildfire and mass death and destruction for most to now see....I'll just leave it at that.
 
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LelandCuz

Billy Hamilton status
Mar 21, 2011
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Lahaina
I mostly enjoyed my 11 years living on Maui. But some of the cons of living there are being highlited now and it took a wildfire and mass death and destruction for most to now see....I'll just leave it at that.
I didn't realize you left. Where'd you go and how's if compare. I've spent the last 20 winters in Lahaina but need to figure something new out for at least the next couple years. I've been all over the world but haven't yet been tempted to leave. I considered renting in Paia this winter but thinking I'll wait at least 2 years to do that. We're not even entirely sure we'll want to live in the new Lahaina after we rebuild. We might just build, then sell the house.
 

Kaser1

Tom Curren status
May 3, 2004
10,271
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Maine
I didn't realize you left. Where'd you go and how's if compare. I've spent the last 20 winters in Lahaina but need to figure something new out for at least the next couple years. I've been all over the world but haven't yet been tempted to leave. I considered renting in Paia this winter but thinking I'll wait at least 2 years to do that. We're not even entirely sure we'll want to live in the new Lahaina after we rebuild. We might just build, then sell the house.
 

grg

Phil Edwards status
Mar 11, 2006
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Tuna Town/Baja
My son lives above Paia and works at Mamas Fish House which is usually a 3-6 month waitlist. They are def. feeling it there :(