What’s happening to regular pneumonia deaths

VonMeister

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Apr 26, 2013
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Here’s the link to the data in the graph:


Notice that the 2020 data ends on week 11, when there were either 56 or 62 total CV-19 deaths in the US.
I'm not going to do it for you dummy. Do you really think the CDC stopped collecting data on week 11?

Why did the CDC release guidelines last week to hospitals telling them to rule all pneumonia deaths as Covid-19 in absence of evidence to the contrary? Seems like questionable science to me.

Stop being a dumb subject and be at least a little curious for crying out loud.
 
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afoaf

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looking at the data, your math doesn't add up

the drop in pneumonia deaths does not correlate with a commensurate rise in covid deaths

it seems that flu/pneumonia deaths are subsiding due to social distancing and shelter in place orders
 

Phi1

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The link is on the graph. It's from the CDC. Craigj532 doesn't like it because he's retarded and doesn't understand it.

The real problem with the data is that any patient that dies from pneumonia is classified as Covid-19 as directed by the CDC by default. They figure they can sort it later so they give a special designation to the not confirmed but not ruled out Covid deaths....but they are in the Covid bucket today. Problem is, when do we get around to testing dead old people for Covid? For instance, the number one killer of dementia patients is pneumonia from food aspiration. Today when a patient like this dies they classify it as Covid until they go back and test it for bacterial or viral, then specifically Covid. We know it's bacterial, It's always been assumed bacterial....but NOW until the test confirmation it's the special designation of Covid. This isn't a small amount of dead people. It's insane.
If only Americans had access to rapid testing. We can't all be oil executives, I guess. :poop:
 
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VonMeister

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looking at the data, your math doesn't add up

the drop in pneumonia deaths does not correlate with a commensurate rise in covid deaths

it seems that flu/pneumonia deaths are subsiding due to social distancing and shelter in place orders
That's not how pneumonia is spread among the at risk groups end of life pneumonia. Immune deficient people get pneumonia from every day germs and are highly susceptible to bacterial pneumonia from things like aspirating food. Social distancing has no effect on this and generally these people are socially distant anyway. It's why pneumonia kills so many people every year...it's a tertiary complication for unhealthy people.

Generally there aren't autopsies or after death studies performed because we know why they primarily are sick and why they died from pneumonia. Now the CDC is issuing guidance to move those people into the Covid death bucket in absence of information otherwise.
 

Ifallalot

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You guys are also forgetting a large part of this drop in flu/pneumonia is because people are staying home and not interacting with the public.

It's hard to be contagious when isolated.
That means the only answer to keep us safe is #StayAtHome forever

We don't need rights or jobs. Its for our safety!

And the people who are cheerleading this on show how easy it could take place
 
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casa_mugrienta

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There are really tough decisions ahead but these decisions need to start being made now.

We are going to fook up our healthcare system in a disastrous way if we don't.

Hospitals are losing a ton of money right now - preparing for this, building makeshift negative pressure rooms, cancelling all elective surgeries, etc.

Cancellation of elective surgeries is why you're seeing a lot of "empty hospitals".

What hospitals should've done is isolate all suspected COVID19 patients in one area and isolate all confirmed cases in another area.

Then carried on with elective surgeries for low-risk patients as planned in a "clean" section of the hospital, testing these patients prior to surgery with the 8 - 12 hour COVID test.

I'm expecting pay cuts and/or layoffs.
 
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afoaf

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That's not how pneumonia is spread among the at risk groups end of life pneumonia. Immune deficient people get pneumonia from every day germs and are highly susceptible to bacterial pneumonia from things like aspirating food. Social distancing has no effect on this and generally these people are socially distant anyway. It's why pneumonia kills so many people every year...it's a tertiary complication for unhealthy people.

Generally there aren't autopsies or after death studies performed because we know why they primarily are sick and why they died from pneumonia. Now the CDC is issuing guidance to move those people into the Covid death bucket in absence of information otherwise.
noted, but it still doesn't address the point that we didn't see thousands of covid deaths
appearing at the corresponding time that the pneumonia trend line dips....there were less
than 100 reported at that time
 

craigj532

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I'm not going to do it for you dummy. Do you really think the CDC stopped collecting data on week 11?

Why did the CDC release guidelines last week to hospitals telling them to rule all pneumonia deaths as Covid-19 in absence of evidence to the contrary? Seems like questionable science to me.

Stop being a dumb subject and be at least a little curious for crying out loud.
So, in other words, you were wrong and the graph you got from one of your sources of talking points doesn’t show what you claimed it showed and now your claim is based on other “data” that’s not reflected in the graph?

You posted the graph and you didn’t bother to look into what it reflected at all. But everyone else is stupid. Or you were being purposefully misleading to try to score political points. Which is it?
 

VonMeister

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Apr 26, 2013
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noted, but it still doesn't address the point that we didn't see thousands of covid deaths
appearing at the corresponding time that the pneumonia trend line dips....there were less
than 100 reported at that time
So look at more data if you are curious.

In 8 days we've gone from 2.2 million expected deaths to 83,000. We're getting into seasonal flu territory now. (4000 per week in 2018 according to Anne Schachat from the US CDC).

Why is it now necessary to add every and all pneumonia complications to the Covid bucket? Coincidence or is there a need to drive up the numbers.

If you stand back and look at it..... the fact that half of US deaths come from a city with 3% of the US population should be statistically impossible. Unless of course a percentage of the COVID-19 deaths there are miscategorized, like what happened in Italy. I'm not suggesting it's impossible, but statistically it's a long stretch from acceptable.
 
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casa_mugrienta

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Apr 13, 2008
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Patient with ARDS
Standard viral swab comes back negative for everything.
No indication of bacterial infection.
etc

respiratory infection of unknown origin....
 

FecalFace

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That's what scares me.

It's so precarious.
Seriously?

You think that vaccine will take "forever"?
The beautiful new COVID tests that take 15 minutes and that everyone can take, will not be available "forever"?

Or are you just going with ifailalot's hyperbole because you two didn't have a circle jerk for a while?
 

casa_mugrienta

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Seriously?

You think that vaccine will take "forever"?
12 months minimum, then production, vaccination, etc

So you're looking at a long long time.

IF they even come up with a working vaccine.

The beautiful new COVID tests that take 15 minutes and that everyone can take, will not be available "forever"?
They are not glucometer style tests.
 

FecalFace

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12 months minimum, then production, vaccination, etc

So you're looking at a long long time.

IF they even come up with a working vaccine.



They are not glucometer style tests.
Okay but you agreed with ifailalot's hyperbole that we will stay sheltered in place "forever", lose our jobs, starve to death and government will insert chips in our necks.
 

casa_mugrienta

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Okay but you agreed with ifailalot's hyperbole that we will stay sheltered in place "forever", lose our jobs, starve to death and government will insert chips in our necks.
I think

a) There are people who think this sort of thing can be maintained more than a few months. The economic ramifications of that, not to mention the domino effect collateral damage, will be a vision of hell unlike the world has ever known.
b) see my post in the When will the beaches open? thread.

We are dealing with a globalized world and a global economy where everyone is dealing with this at the same time. That is the aspect that is unprecedented. The wrong decisions can have very, very bad results.