The Jordan Peterson Thread

HatterasGlass

Michael Peterson status
Apr 6, 2008
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Curious as to the erBB's take on the guy.
As an introduction:

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enframed

Tom Curren status
Apr 11, 2006
11,639
6,431
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Del Boca Vista, Phase III
The term "useful idiot" comes to mind.

I tried to watch this. God he's just insufferable. Throws around "fifth column" like it wasn't a term created by fascists. The amount he contradicts himself is startling.

He's Canadian so I don't understand why any Americans listen to anything he has to say about anything. Probably has six different flavors of ketchup in his house.
 
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HatterasGlass

Michael Peterson status
Apr 6, 2008
2,079
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The term "useful idiot" comes to mind.
Your immediate name calling is telling.
The guy makes a lot of sense and has a history that very much negates your claim.

This thread isn't a trap or a hook.
Its to open up real discussion.

Set your partisan self aside and listen.

His 12 rules for life:
  1. 1. "Stand up straight with your shoulders back"
  2. 2. "Treat yourself like you are someone you are responsible for helping"
  3. 3. "Make friends with people who want the best for you"
  4. 4. "Compare yourself with who you were yesterday, not with who someone else is today"
  5. 5. "Do not let your children do anything that makes you dislike them"
  6. 6. "Set your house in perfect order before you criticize the world"
  7. 7. "Pursue what is meaningful (not what is expedient)"
  8. 8. "Tell the truth — or, at least, don’t lie"
  9. 9. "Assume that the person you are listening to might know something you don’t"
  10. 10. "Be precise in your speech"
  11. 11. "Do not bother children when they are skateboarding"
  12. 12. "Pet a cat when you encounter one on the street"
 
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enframed

Tom Curren status
Apr 11, 2006
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Del Boca Vista, Phase III
Your immediate name calling is telling.
The guy makes a lot of sense and has a history that very much negates your claim.

This thread isn't a trap or a hook.
Its to open up real discussion.

Set your partisan self aside and listen.

His 12 rules for life:
  1. 1. "Stand up straight with your shoulders back"
  2. 2. "Treat yourself like you are someone you are responsible for helping"
  3. 3. "Make friends with people who want the best for you"
  4. 4. "Compare yourself with who you were yesterday, not with who someone else is today"
  5. 5. "Do not let your children do anything that makes you dislike them"
  6. 6. "Set your house in perfect order before you criticize the world"
  7. 7. "Pursue what is meaningful (not what is expedient)"
  8. 8. "Tell the truth — or, at least, don’t lie"
  9. 9. "Assume that the person you are listening to might know something you don’t"
  10. 10. "Be precise in your speech"
  11. 11. "Do not bother children when they are skateboarding"
  12. 12. "Pet a cat when you encounter one on the street"
I've spent way too much time trying to watch his videos. Many people I know and like and respect and talk about him a certain way that from where I stand does not jibe with what comes out of his mouth. I just don't get it. I mean somehow people get something from him that I don't hear in his message.

At best he's a life coach for people who lean to the right, politically.

"Be precise in your speech." Jesus, he should try that sometime.

The skateboarding rule, if true, is great, but not enough for me to respect him.
 

grapedrink

Duke status
May 21, 2011
25,927
14,713
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A Beach
Nobody has been more successful at eliciting butthurt from the wackjob element of the left (read: not all lefties and/or democrats), without actually saying inflammatory things, as Jordan Peterson. The vitriol directed at him is completely unfounded.

That said, I have a hard time listening to him.
 
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HatterasGlass

Michael Peterson status
Apr 6, 2008
2,079
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I've spent way too much time trying to watch his videos. Many people I know and like and respect and talk about him a certain way that from where I stand does not jibe with what comes out of his mouth. I just don't get it. I mean somehow people get something from him that I don't hear in his message.

At best he's a life coach for people who lean to the right, politically.

"Be precise in your speech." Jesus, he should try that sometime.

The skateboarding rule, if true, is great, but not enough for me to respect him.
He's not the easiest on the ears.

What gets me about the guy is his ability to not let passion get in the way of critical thought and that the ability to converse on a subject without taking sides/teams is paramount to the ability to solve problems for the common good.

Equality of outcome vs equality of opportunity is a great topic..
The paralells to the BLM movement and ANTIFA to historical precedent is another.
 

HatterasGlass

Michael Peterson status
Apr 6, 2008
2,079
1,064
113
The term "useful idiot" comes to mind.

I tried to watch this. God he's just insufferable. Throws around "fifth column" like it wasn't a term created by fascists. The amount he contradicts himself is startling.

He's Canadian so I don't understand why any Americans listen to anything he has to say about anything. Probably has six different flavors of ketchup in his house.
Like I said - Mozart, he is not and I think he has trouble getting out everything that is coming down the pike clearly - likely due to the volume rather than the message.

I've never taken a thing a Canadian has said to heart, ever - until this guy comes along and even then, I'm hearing The McKenzie Brothers in the background.

But I think the fact that he's an outsider looking in at our culture gives him a unique perspective.
Getting past the political, though, you can't argue with alot of what he says for how to look at one's own life - from a clinical psychologist's POV, at least.
 

enframed

Tom Curren status
Apr 11, 2006
11,639
6,431
113
Del Boca Vista, Phase III
"Post-modern Neo-Marxism" sounds really scary.

This is a guy that says that *corporate HR departments are out to destroy capitalism.*

I'll type that again, just to make sure everyone sees this.

*corporate HR departments are out to destroy capitalism.*

Does anyone here actually think that [insert corporation here] would allow its own HR department to provide training it thought was designed to bring about its own demise? Does Peterson really think that he is the savior of corporations and capitalism?

Does anyone here actually think that capitalism is under threat right now? How's the stock market? Capitalism appears to perform its best while under significant threat then.



Like I said - Mozart, he is not and I think he has trouble getting out everything that is coming down the pike clearly - likely due to the volume rather than the message.

I've never taken a thing a Canadian has said to heart, ever - until this guy comes along and even then, I'm hearing The McKenzie Brothers in the background.

But I think the fact that he's an outsider looking in at our culture gives him a unique perspective.
Getting past the political, though, you can't argue with alot of what he says for how to look at one's own life - from a clinical psychologist's POV, at least.
There's no volume nor message from Peterson, politically. It's all over the place. His rhetoric is juvenile. Plausible deniability is his best friend. We get a lot of that these days so we've maybe become numb to it.

I've never read anything of his more "psychological stuff" because I eschew self-help books.

From the titles of his books and synopses I've read, he's like Carl Jung for people who listen to Oasis.
 

Autoprax

Duke status
Jan 24, 2011
68,226
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62
Vagina Point
I like some of the things he says and other I don't agree with.

I like the idea if you have too much disorder in your life, you need to add some order.

But that goes back to the Greeks.

But it's a great heuristic for judging what you are doing if you are having issues.

(Great art is lots of order and disorder.)

Dumb people need simple solutions to get smarter.

Get you life in order is good advice.

Some people can't and society needs to address that.
 

Autoprax

Duke status
Jan 24, 2011
68,226
22,978
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Vagina Point
I don't understand the Neo-marxist stuff.

I think it's just people using identity politics to make a resource grab.

Which is what people do.

You use what is available.

It's really gets a lot of attention at my school.

We get a lot of anti-racist propaganda every day via email, and only 2% of the student population is black.

A thoughtful person cannot help but be fazed by this incongruity.

I think it's virtue signaling by the admins.
 

Sharkbiscuit

Duke status
Aug 6, 2003
26,252
19,081
113
Jacksonville Beach
  1. 1. "Stand up straight with your shoulders back"
  2. 2. "Treat yourself like you are someone you are responsible for helping"
  3. 3. "Make friends with people who want the best for you"
  4. 4. "Compare yourself with who you were yesterday, not with who someone else is today"
  5. 5. "Do not let your children do anything that makes you dislike them"
  6. 6. "Set your house in perfect order before you criticize the world"
  7. 7. "Pursue what is meaningful (not what is expedient)"
  8. 8. "Tell the truth — or, at least, don’t lie"
  9. 9. "Assume that the person you are listening to might know something you don’t"
  10. 10. "Be precise in your speech"
  11. 11. "Do not bother children when they are skateboarding"
  12. 12. "Pet a cat when you encounter one on the street"
#5 is vomit-inducing. If my kid was a Christian psych douche with a Canadian Kermit accent and a successful lifecoach podcast, those would be things that make me dislike them, but they're my kid and they're doing them, so good on them and f--k me in all holes.
#6 would mean nobody complains about anything, ever, because nobody's house is in perfect order.
Most cats haul ass in terror when they see me. The very rare cat that actually closes the distance with curiosity, that one is generally a well-treated pet. The others, no matter how nice the cat is, if it's scared and doesn't know you, do not pet the fucking thing. I repeat, do not fucking touch a cat that doesn't seem like it wants to be touched.

#11, he lives somewhere there's snow/ice on the ground for like 9 months of the year. Film a street snow part on the handrail outside his office at whatever University in Ontario he got booted from - oh wait; he's booted - and see if he bothers you.

The "rules" aren't that bad, it's when he starts explaining his thinking process.

"Dr." Jordan Peterson wound up laid out in a hospital in fucking Serbia with COVID for weeks because he went to Russia for what I think was some quack treatment for a pill addiction that they didn't offer in Canada, and while he didn't get straight up Novichok'd, I don't think it went as well as hoped.
#Darwinning

His traditional conservative/Christian thing, that's a serious basis for his blather, and that's 100% opinion discarded, into the trash it goes. IMHO it's practically incompatible with women's economic independence, and their liberty means more than Jordan Peterson fetishizing the 1950s.

I don't actually agree with Chapo Trap House's politics. I do like the dirtbag part, but I'm 100% the enemy within who they hate the most. We're both left but they detest Gen-X center-left Klobuchar types. They're scared they'll get Klobburred. And charred.

But them dragging Peterson is hilarious.

"Consider the Lobster"
 

HatterasGlass

Michael Peterson status
Apr 6, 2008
2,079
1,064
113
The intent here was not to paint the guy as a saint - as obviously as of late, he has been laid bare as an absolute regular human being with all of their inherent flaws. At least the guy isn't trying to hide that.

Re: the Jung comment, that is ironic as Peterson has spoken about Jung saying,

" And I never came across anybody who had a deeper understanding of narrative than Carl Jung. So his work was unbelievably influential for me, partly because it was through Jung that I started to understand the metaphysics of the idea of the sovereignty of the individual, which I think is the great Western idea, that the fundamental perceptual — what would you say? — that the most appropriate perceptual framework for a social interaction at the familial and the community level is to view each individual as unique and sovereign."

Meaning - all this playing of teams and groupings (Alt-Left and Alt-Right, BLM, ANTIFA, KKK, etc) is bull$hit because it presupposes that that group power should always outweight the individual - which is contrary to everything beneficial.

F you and your "team." I matter just as much as you matter. Lets talk it out - if the other side will let you.....

He quotes the Bible as much as he quote Nietzsche so I don't follow the Christian part of the argument.

I just enjoy intellectual talk.

If you have a favorite, post a link - I'm all ears.