The Bezt Complexes/Circuits and Intervals for Surfing

[VonMeister]

Getting volume out of back-off sets seems mentally a ton easier than doing triples for sets across at the highest RPE. I bet the bar speed is a lot better in the back-off sets. Speaking of that, do you think speed factors into intensity? For example, if I'm working closer to my 1 RM, my RPE will be greater but the bar speed will be slower. If I take weight off the bar, I can move it a ton faster and still keep my RPE high, can't I?

RPE or intensity will be lower and bar speed doesn't do much to change that.....but bar speed is a driver of motor unit recruitment so being aware and using warm up sets or back off sets to maximize bar speed is useful. It's something I'm aware of when I'm fatigue'd and its easy to start tempoing reps instead of just doing them.

 

[PRCD]

RPE or intensity will be lower and bar speed doesn't do much to change that.....but bar speed is a driver of motor unit recruitment so being aware and using warm up sets or back off sets to maximize bar speed is useful. It's something I'm aware of when I'm fatigue'd and its easy to start tempoing reps instead of just doing them.

Thanks. So you do not see much benefit to dynamic effort days?

Also, could you please answer my question about what to do for rest periods when anaerobic training on the assault bike. Do you just cruise at a low pace, or do you get off the bike completely?

 

[VonMeister]

Thanks. So you do not see much benefit to dynamic effort days?

Also, could you please answer my question about what to do for rest periods when anaerobic training on the assault bike. Do you just cruise at a low pace, or do you get off the bike completely?

I'm not sure what you mean by dynamic effort...I may have missed it. I will say all effort and stress is good as long as it fits your goals and is reasonable. Day three for me usually involves a squat variation at low RPE but high reps...10-12 and I concentrate on keeping a pace during these.

On the 1:6 you can do nothing or just coast...it really doesn't matter. You're not getting any work by slowly peddling but some people prefer it. It's a ball breaker but it's probably the single biggest improvement I made to paddling out on big days because you get adapted to maximum effort on low oxygen and cycling that as you duck dive.

 

[PRCD]

I'm not sure what you mean by dynamic effort...I may have missed it. I will say all effort and stress is good as long as it fits your goals and is reasonable. Day three for me usually involves a squat variation at low RPE but high reps...10-12 and I concentrate on keeping a pace during these.

Dynamic effort is the Westside Barbell idea of doing fast reps with lighter weights on certain days. The goal is increased power production as a training variable to recruit other motor units not trained with slower, heavier reps:

Dynamic Effort Method™ - Circa 2009

The dynamic method is sometimes referred to as speed work. There are some who think it is not necessary to work on speed. This is just one part of the total strength equation. Sometimes when people read a little, they become dangerous. A little knowledge can be a curse. One day a couple lifters...

westside-barbell.com

On the 1:6 you can do nothing or just coast...it really doesn't matter. You're not getting any work by slowly peddling but some people prefer it. It's a ball breaker but it's probably the single biggest improvement I made to paddling out on big days because you get adapted to maximum effort on low oxygen and cycling that as you duck dive.

Thanks!!

Years ago when I did SSLP the last few weeks were miserable. I was always fighting fatigue, wanted to sleep all day and every training session was 2 hours minimum. I got strong no doubt but it was unsustainable for a guy in his 40's and just moving to a HLM or modified Texas method wasn't going to be the answer. Now in my 50's I train regularly, I'm stronger than before and still able to walk 2 or 3 rounds of golf per week and surf daily if there's swell in the water.

Grinding out reps is a young mans game.

It's amazing how much of this is a learning process and how much strength and training are learned responses. Age is not nothing, but it's definitely not everything.

I have a chronic pain condition which impairs my ability to train and recover. As near as I can tell, I've accomplished a lot more in teh weight room than a lot of other people by trying to train smarter.

 

[Havoc]

yeah i'm getting tired of grinding. you might add 20-30 lbs to your lifts but at what expense. gonna talk with my coach bc even twice a week HLM is making we too fatigued to surf. wish i was 20 years younger

 

[Havoc]

i might just switch to gymnastic rings. fk it

 

[VonMeister]

I wouldn't put too much thought into anything Westside Barbell produces. If you want to do a bunch of steroids, lift equipped, squat high and pull sumo than Westside is for you. No top level powerlifters are from Westside Barbell and their claim of record holders is bullshit. To train there you have to be strong and have good genetics for sure...but you also are going to be juicing like a female Bulgarian olympian to the point where staring at weights will get you stronger .........and then die young of heart disease.

 

[VonMeister]

yeah i'm getting tired of grinding. you might add 20-30 lbs to your lifts but at what expense. gonna talk with my coach bc even twice a week HLM is making we too fatigued to surf. wish i was 20 years younger

You need to figure out what type of training you respond to best and do that. There's going to be adjustments along the way but you shouldn't be struggling.

 

[VonMeister]

I like the way I program (of course). But there are many programs and training programs that allow people to make good progress towards whatever goal they have.

Any program that follows generally sound programming principals has a reasonably good chance of providing benefits to the trainee and for beginning trainee its almost as though anything will work for most people as evidenced by potatoes making gains by all sorts of silly looking internet garbage due to the training sensitivity of novices....but that's also not always the best approach.

Any program being delivered as "works for everyone every time is bullshit...as are any programs that claim to fix imagined things like imbalances or muscle firing problems. Poor responders to training stress will fail in short order on these type of programs.

Strength is specific. Random exercises may make you tired or build fatigue....but they don't always make you stronger...not for long anyway.

 

[Autoprax]

On the 1:6 you can do nothing or just coast...it really doesn't matter. You're not getting any work by slowly peddling but some people prefer it. It's a ball breaker but it's probably the single biggest improvement I made to paddling out on big days because you get adapted to maximum effort on low oxygen and cycling that as you duck dive.

Are you still in Hawaii?

Do you train at home or in a gym there?

 

[PRCD]

I like the way I program (of course). But there are many programs and training programs that allow people to make good progress towards whatever goal they have.

Any program that follows generally sound programming principals has a reasonably good chance of providing benefits to the trainee and for beginning trainee its almost as though anything will work for most people as evidenced by potatoes making gains by all sorts of silly looking internet garbage due to the training sensitivity of novices....but that's also not always the best approach.

Any program being delivered as "works for everyone every time is bullshit...as are any programs that claim to fix imagined things like imbalances or muscle firing problems. Poor responders to training stress will fail in short order on these type of programs.

Strength is specific. Random exercises may make you tired or build fatigue....but they don't always make you stronger...not for long anyway.

How did you learn programming and exercise science? Finding a coach is a nightmare.

 

[VonMeister]

How did you learn programming and exercise science? Finding a coach is a nightmare.

Voracious appetite for knowledge and getting good advice. I also attended seminars and conferences on pain management, and different biology and physics seminars and conferences I thought were interesting and audited courses at a local med school when allowed. An old user here..bobblehead turned me onto pain management as a practice and it was probably the most interesting rabbit hole I've been in. I also relentlessly did what I could to train with the guys who I thought were doing it right. I've been completely ignored at some of the best strength gyms in the country just to absorb while I poverty lift in the corner while these guys were lifting three times what my goal weights were. The only thing that kept me from pursuing a formal education and doing it full time was I was in my late 30's and starting over would have drastically effected my income. By sheer luck I was able to make the connections and train some people with influence that allowed me to build this hobby into something really fun. Of course I'm also my own test dummy and while what works for me doesn't always work for the next guy... I can recognize the things I see in myself that are a tell that a change is needed. Lastly I've always defaulted to keeping these as simple as possible...which is why I always default to the simplest of implements....the barbell. I am a novice strength and conditioning coach...but far enough down the skillset road to train 90% of the public and most young athletes and if I'm stuck I know where to go for advice.

For me the beginning was 15 or so years ago after being recommended back surgery. Surgery got delays and I went for a second opinion with another neurosurgeon who advised me to go see a friend of his who was a Dr and a strength coach. I went form being immobile for 4+ months, (herniated and desiccated discs from L3 through S1 with a sequestered fragment wedged against a nerve ganglion at L4-L5) to pulling 315 about a year later, and pulling 450 6 months after that. The body will heal if you let it and part of this healing is application of stress. Today I actually train deadlifts with my back slightly rounded so my body is trained to pull in that position. There is no one on earth that pulls heavy with a back still in extension. It's physically impossible so you may as well add stress in the actual position you will eventually be in or you're just going to get hurt......but we're told a rounded back will paralyze you.

There's very few S&C coaches out there that I could recommend and even then most of them are paid a lot of money to focus their attention on athletes so unless you have the scratch for their attention you need to do a lot of homework and recognize bullshit quickly.

 

[VonMeister]

Are you still in Hawaii?

Do you train at home or in a gym there?

Family is in Hawaii...I'm splitting time between Hawaii, CA and Texas which is easier now that Hawaii isn't requiring a 14 day quarantine. I have home gyms in Hawaii and Ca and Gyms are open in Texas.

 

[PRCD]

Voracious appetite for knowledge and getting good advice. I also attended seminars and conferences on pain management,

Have you read "Explain Pain?"
and different biology and physics seminars and conferences I thought were interesting and audited courses at a local med school when allowed. An old user here..bobblehead turned me onto pain management as a practice and it was probably the most interesting rabbit hole I've been in. I also relentlessly did what I could to train with the guys who I thought were doing it right. I've been completely ignored at some of the best strength gyms in the country just to absorb while I poverty lift in the corner while these guys were lifting three times what my goal weights were. The only thing that kept me from pursuing a formal education and doing it full time was I was in my late 30's and starting over would have drastically effected my income. [/quote]
I know that feel.

Lastly I've always defaulted to keeping these as simple as possible...which is why I always default to the simplest of implements....the barbell. I am a novice strength and conditioning coach...but far enough down the skillset road to train 90% of the public and most young athletes and if I'm stuck I know where to go for advice.

I'd definitely buy your book if you wrote one.

For me the beginning was 15 or so years ago after being recommended back surgery. Surgery got delays and I went for a second opinion with another neurosurgeon who advised me to go see a friend of his who was a Dr and a strength coach. I went form being immobile for 4+ months, (herniated and desiccated discs from L3 through S1 with a sequestered fragment wedged against a nerve ganglion at L4-L5) to pulling 315 about a year later, and pulling 450 6 months after that. The body will heal if you let it and part of this healing is application of stress. Today I actually train deadlifts with my back slightly rounded so my body is trained to pull in that position. There is no one on earth that pulls heavy with a back still in extension. It's physically impossible so you may as well add stress in the actual position you will eventually be in or you're just going to get hurt......but we're told a rounded back will paralyze you.

The USA has a very "Cartesian" and mechanical view of the spine and pain. The body was made to move. A lot of people in the orthopedic industry try to convince you that movement is dangerous. This seems to be motivated by how they get paid. As Lorimer Mosely said in "Explain Pain", pro athletes put their "disks" (which he renamed "Living Adaptable Force Transducers or LAFTs") in all types of positions with massive forces all the time and are fine.

There's very few S&C coaches out there that I could recommend and even then most of them are paid a lot of money to focus their attention on athletes so unless you have the scratch for their attention you need to do a lot of homework and recognize bullshit quickly.

This is the problem for us @Havoc and me. Do you have an opinion on these guys? A friend recommended them.

Juggernaut Training Systems | Experts in strength

The world's most advanced and effective programming and coaching for Powerlifting, Weightlifting, BJJ, SuperTotal and Sports Performance.

www.jtsstrength.com

 

[VonMeister]

Chad Wesley Smith is the real deal. He was someone who I would always listen to and approach for knowledge. He's recently lost a full sized human in weight and is now competing in BJJ tournaments. Juggernaut personal coaching isn't cheap. I haven't used their app based programs or nutrition programs but Ive heard nothing but good things and never anything negative. App based programs require you to invest in your training a bit more than if you were being coached in person. For instance, I can watch your bar speed and limb position and know what type of effort your putting out. At the same time I can judge my own effort as I train, and when I review video I know I over estimated the set RPE and probably should have increased the weight a bit to hit my numbers. The inner bitch is strong. As you learn more and more you learn to judge personal effort differently. This is a long way of saying that if you're going to do remote or app based training, get an adjustable iPhone stand and video your sets to review later. Takes notes about what you felt and compare.

 

[PRCD]

Chad Wesley Smith is the real deal. He was someone who I would always listen to and approach for knowledge. He's recently lost a full sized human in weight and is now competing in BJJ tournaments. Juggernaut personal coaching isn't cheap. I haven't used their app based programs or nutrition programs but Ive heard nothing but good things and never anything negative. App based programs require you to invest in your training a bit more than if you were being coached in person. For instance, I can watch your bar speed and limb position and know what type of effort your putting out. At the same time I can judge my own effort as I train, and when I review video I know I over estimated the set RPE and probably should have increased the weight a bit to hit my numbers. The inner bitch is strong.

I'm going to get their book. My friend recommended it. He's a powerlifter, CSCS, and PT assistant. He takes this seriously:

Scientific Principles of Strength Training | Juggernaut Training Systems

Scientific Principles goes far beyond just giving you sets and reps to use for a few weeks or months, rather it will empower you with knowledge to create effective training programs and make informed answers to tough training problems for a lifetime.

www.jtsstrength.com

The good thing about RPE is the feedback it provides into the program and the session. Too many trainers want to just throw a program over the wall and call it a day.

As you learn more and more you learn to judge personal effort differently. This is a long way of saying that if you're going to do remote or app based training, get an adjustable iPhone stand and video your sets to review later. Takes notes about what you felt and compare.

Yes. So much of training intensity is learned. Weaklings like to point to strong guys and say, "Genetics! Steroids!" but that isn't it.

 

[PRCD]

@Havoc https://www.jtsstrength.com/product/the-hybrid-athlete/

 

[Chocki]

You all sure like to make things complicated for yourselves. You know who I’d bet the farm on not giving a sh!t about RPE, etc?

This bad ass

 

[PRCD]

You all sure like to make things complicated for yourselves. You know who I’d bet the farm on not giving a sh!t about RPE, etc?

This bad ass

It would impress me more if she found a man, bore him children, and kept house.

I don't think RPE overcomplicates things. You need to gauge your workout stress and effort off of internal cues or you won't progress. I have verified this experimentally.

Tempo and rest intervals are certainly an overcomplication of strength training.

 

[Havoc]

i already have top tier strength coach. i think sport specific training for surfing is nonexistent thats the issue