Some help getting started

nowayout

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Nov 8, 2010
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Can someone point me in the right direction on what I need to get started prone surf foiling? I have wake foiled a bunch off a buddies boat and im pretty much hooked. Ive been surfing for over 25 years and the feeling of foiling is incredible.

I'm not sure if I should piece everything together or buy a package. I also dont know what size board I would need (im 170 lbs) and what size wing, mast, and tail I need. I am a strong paddler in the surf. I mostly ride a 5'7" surfboard.

Locally is not an option as where I live in NY as there is no one surf foiling.
 

nowayout

OTF status
Nov 8, 2010
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Im thinking new only because there is not much of a used market by me and with shipping etc from other places it will be close to new prices.
As for budget Im not really sure but I dont have fook you money, so the better the deal the better
 

Hdip

Michael Peterson status
Apr 23, 2005
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I'm not to sure of East coast distances and how getting around with Covid works right now, but there is this for a board.


This might be worth it if shipping isn't to much. Could be worth an email. The nice thing about this is that's a huge wing that will get you up in tiny 1 foot East coast waves, then in a few months or a year you can just buy the new GoFoil wings like the NL190 and you're already in an system that is expandable.


If you want to go new and Axis you can go with this setup I recently switched to. Axis is fully interchangeable, comes out with new wings often and is pretty future proof.


S-series front wing - 900mm +$533 (the 910 is the newer version and slightly more, I haven't ridden it, but reviews say they're very very similar, so I saved some money here)
S-Series rear wing- 370mm (the 390 get's good reviews too, I haven't ridden it) +$185
S-Series Fuselage- Ultra Short S-Series Fuselabe +$267
Aluminum mast length 16mm- 75cm +$108
Fuselage/mast adapter- 16mm +$74
Mast plate 16mm- 16mm +$109
screws/tefGel- $56
Total $1332.

Lol Takuma has a new foil coming out very soon so the current Lol Takuma series is on sale some places. It's supposed to be real good. The 1600 would be an amazing pump wing and tiny wave wing. For slightly bigger waves like waist high or more you'd probably want the 1300 which is supposed to turn really well and still pump quite well. https://chinooksailing.com/collections/takuma-foils/products/lol-profoil-lb-ac-complete?variant=31733853356087 That's not a sale price, but it's somewhere I found it in stock.

Then there's Signature/Unifoil which I've never ridden but all the instagram influencers love (they get them for free) and the good foiler's I know who ride them say they're fast and light.

MFC is super light and very high performance, but not a learning foil and they should be releasing a new design next year.

The new cloud9 F series looks really good in the water. Full carbon setup. https://cloud9surffoils.com/collections/all-products/products/copy-of-full-carbon-foil-package-carbon-mast-carbon-fuselage-carbon-wings?variant=31707687747678 Probably the f32 size for small East Coast waves. $1799.

Lift is solid and their new high aspect is supposed to be an amazing pump wing for downwind.

Armstrong is the rolls royce of the foiling world currently. Really smooth foils, great connections, cost a ton.

It sort of comes down to, Aluminum setup $1300+. Carbon setup $1700+.

Boards: You want a "track/plate mount" those terms are interchangeable depending on brand it seems. Basically 2 big fin boxes which allow you to move the foil forward or back to dial in lift. You do not want "tuttle mount". That's why I've never used GoFoil, they default their masts to tuttle mount and you need a plate mount adapter.

I can't really help to much here. I've been using my original board for over 2 years now. You can watch @usedfoils on instagram, I think he's based out of San Diego though and the boards on there are still over $700. Mackite might have sales on production boards, but I've never used any of those brands. You could try messaging @the.progression.project on instagram. He has a really good podcast you should definitely listen to (just the foiling series, not the original SUP series). He also shapes boards and might get you a good deal.

Edit: I forgot one option. https://www.mackiteboarding.com/2019-neil-pryde-glide-foil-set/ Buy the XL in that set. $1149. That's supposed to be a real solid system to learn on. Then in 6 months or a year get the new front wings (not out yet) for it which look real good.
 
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nowayout

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Nov 8, 2010
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My head is spinning but I like the Axis or the Neil Pryde.

on the Wake foil I ride the front wing is 76cm. I see most that you recommend or much larger than that. Is it because there is less power from a ocean wave compared to a a boat wake from a wake boat?

As for boards what about something like the Naish Ascend or https://www.mackiteboarding.com/kt-drifter-pro-foil-surfboard/

Also is any of the Slingshot stuff any good?
 
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Jan 12, 2020
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It’s the speed. Way more power in an ocean wave (on weight alone.) but you’re moving slowly.

One other note, any big foil will get you started. If you look at the forums (zone, sea breeze, etc) you will find a good deal. Don’t sweat buying remotely. Most folks on those forums have been on for years so there’s a decent community and accountability.
 
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Hdip

Michael Peterson status
Apr 23, 2005
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Slingshot stuff I've never ridden. I've heard they are fine, but heavy. The only footage I've watched of them is when Brett Barley had it in one of his blogs and it didn't look like it was doing him any favors.

Realwatersports youtube channel has lots of foil reviews on it that are fun to watch.


You don't really need that 280 wing, but it seems to be a decent deal. You'd need to buy the tuttle to plate mount adapter, so you're coming up on the price of a new Aluminum setup. But you'll be in the GoFoil system which is all carbon and will be lighter than most and is a very solid system.

Oh and as far as size goes. Bigger is slower to roll rail to rail and is more stable. It will catch smaller waves easier and pump further easier. It will be slightly less high performance than a smaller wing. If you're already used to slingshot try to find one of those used. I bet it would be in the $350 range. If you know you're going to stick with it, I'd go for one of the main established brands I wrote about above.

https://www.foilfeed.net/listing/f-l-i-e-foil-boards-surf-foilboard-gofoil-surf-package/

This doesn't seem to be the best deal around, but not a bad deal either. Figure the foils are $1100 and that makes the board around $700? The Iwa will be a good surf wing until you're ready to go to a high aspect wing. The 200 will be a great learning wing or tiny wave wing.
 
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Hdip

Michael Peterson status
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no to the cloud 9. Only consider the f series for cloud 9.

the naish is fine. A step below axis in my opinion. I’d suggest the bigger wing than the 1250 though. Naish seems to be pretty interchangeable and cost effective when you want to change wings too. Their new mast looks real good. The abracadabra system isn’t worth it in my eyes. Just heavier and doesn’t save much time as I see it.
 
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grendel95

Billy Hamilton status
Nov 1, 2005
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FWIW you might be surprised if you get out of the "surf shop bubble" and look at kite/SUP shops. They don't always have the gear you're looking for but you might be surprised what you find (older Naish thrust foil or Go foil) .

MacKite has good deal on demo gear and Real watersports has pretty good prices on package stuff.

foilfeed.net has a pretty good classifieds section as well.
 
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juandesooka

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Jan 12, 2009
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I rode slingshot a couple years before switching to gofoil. It works fine, it is economical, all interchangeable so can pick and choose bits and pieces, and lots of used options out there. A great starter, then when you upgrade, pass it on for what you paid.

People seem pretty excited about NP too as a similar starter option.

I went with GoFoil, as it was the cat's meow 2-3 years ago, so I took on others' leftovers as they went for the new latest/greatest. You can troll the hawaii craigslist and get really cheap package deals, if you can convince them to ship it -- shipping expensive though. Guy I bought from said he couldn't give his away over there, so many already own them, so many moving on to other brands (though this may have lessened now with the GL and NL high aspect wings available).
 
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nowayout

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Ok so I am down to 3
But after building the Axis to the specs above I read this "It is not recommended to use wings larger than 750mm with 16mm masts"
So that has me worried about that one and the total price is $1332

The Naish are on sale and I can get a complete surf foil 1650 front wing, 450 stabilizer, and 65cm mast for $990

And Neil Pryde but I am not sure which size but the Large is complete for $949

Obviously the cost of the Naish and NP are swaying me in their direction but I am open to other opinions.

Again I appreciate the help here
 

Hdip

Michael Peterson status
Apr 23, 2005
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If you're fine with the Axis price, consider the Lol Takuma 1300 too, it's being rated as the best all around foil by a lot of people currently. https://wetfeetsports.com/collections/foil/products/takuma-lol-profoil-lb-foil $1290 but do note they have a new version coming out in November.

Yeah it says that. I am on the 16mm mast on the recommendation of Frenchfoiler who posts here. There's no issue using it for prone and the 900. Axis is known for having super stiff masts. Which is the 19mm mast. The 19mm mast is super stiff, but has a bit of drag due to wider 19mm size. So they came up with the 16mm mast which is slightly faster and nearly as stiff. They are both fine for prone.

I was last on a Lift setup which is all carbon and has a mast which flexes. I was tired of the mast flex so went to Axis and using the 16mm mast is totally fine. I don't feel any flex at all.

If you can get the Neil Pryde Large I'd go that route. That Large can be hard to find though. The Slim medium would be OK, but a bit harder to learn on. The XL would be easy to learn on but maybe a bit slow once you're past the initial phase.

Lots of Naish stuff makes it onto craigslist here in Southern California. I don't know if that means anything, just something I noticed. I learned on the 2017 original Naish thrust stuff, it was fine.
 
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nowayout

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Another thing I noticed is that Naish is on sale everywhere, that cant be a good thing in my eyes.

The Takuma looks insane, that might be the one.

I keep thinking about how I foil behind the boat with the 76cm from slingshot and it feels great and wonder why I need such a large wing for prone surf.

But after I figure this out I will decide. I need to order something soon.

Then I need to figure out board
 
Mar 20, 2019
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what are your goals for foiling? what kind of waves? size waves, etc...

My 2 cents: axis, gofoil, signature/unifoil, lift, Armstrong that's what I see most of here in Hawaii, and they all have lots of foil wing options. The takuma looks really good, but have only seen a couple people ride them.

I'm about your weight, in Hawaii, started with a chinese knockoff of a naish, then got a gong foil, then sold those and got the go foil set (kai, iwa, maliko) the iwa was really good. Then I got the axis 900, and have been on Axis since. I have the 19mm mast, and I love how stiff it is. What I like about axis is the amount of wings available. I have options for small waves, big waves, towing, winging, downwinding, etc...

see if this is still available and if they will ship:
 

nowayout

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Nov 8, 2010
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Small waves when I really dont want to surf. So under chest high. All conditions would be great from crumble onshore to little clean swells.

My goals at this point is to just get going. I dont see anyone around here doing it at the moment.

I guess between you and Hdip Axis is probably the best route.

And i need a board. My everyday surfboard is a 5'6" FW dominator. I am a strong paddler. I keep seeing recommendations for my weight to be on a 40 liter board, seems l ike a lot
 

juandesooka

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Jan 12, 2009
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The SS 76 is my foil buddy's primary wing, all last season. All the other options listed will work great too, probably better ... but you already have a wing you are used to that will work just fine, go with that, upgrade later. IMHO.

I think the 76 is perfect mid size for prone foil. At 1500cm2 it is big enough to get into all but the smaller waves and won't get over-foiled the way the 84 does. I rode an 84/H2 combo when I had slingshot gear.

By the way, this Foil Data google docs is really helpful for comparing foils, while you're in the hunt.

Boards: my 5' is roughly 40L and I agree that's about right. Some riders really like the smaller boards, but the paddling gets tough, at least for this old guy. Call me cynical but I don't think many bells or whistles matter much, as long as it floats you, it'll work.
 
Mar 20, 2019
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I'm 6'2 170, learned on a board that was 4'6, maybe 30ishL, went down to a 4'3 32L, back up to a 4'7 39.5L.

They all worked well, but the newest board makes catching waves way easier. I'm excited for winter, because the 4'3 last winter made paddling into overhead waves very difficult. I'd recommend something in the 4ft range in the 30s. You're used to small boards, don't get anything over 5ft unless it is super cheap. It'll make it easier at first but once you get things down, it'll seem too big.

where in NY are you, buddy on Long Island might have something for sale...
 

Hdip

Michael Peterson status
Apr 23, 2005
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I just don’t know the slingshot lineup at all.
if it’s that wing. Which Juan seems to reference too. That’s 1500cm. That’s pretty big. Similar to gofoil iwa.

The naish large is only 1250cm. Much smaller. Less glide, so less pump. naish is about to releasing new gear with a brand new mast. It’ll still be interchangeable, but it’s like kite gear where people sell last years to buy this years.

the lol 1300cm is smaller but way more efficient. the new lol coming out in November will be 980 cm and just as efficient is the claim.

those are all “surf” wings which are “low aspect” longer Chord from front to back and arcing Swept back front edge.

the axis 900 is 1200cm something. But “high aspect”. narrow front to back. Wide side to side. Much flatter arc on the leading edge. tons more efficient. Heaps more glide. slower to roll rail to rail.

Boards: I ride a 4'8" 31 liters. Very similar to my HP shortboard. I wish it was more like my grovel board at 34 liters, but it's fine. Boards have since started packing way way foam into them. They're like paddling a boogie board they're so short. So people want more float to help paddling long distances. The sweet spot for prone seems to be 4'2" - 4'6".

Message this guy about a board. He's in Florida, but comes up to your neck of the woods at times. His podcast is good and ask him if he knows of any deals on used gear. http://instagr.am/p/CEKzHECjfop/
 
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steamroller

Michael Peterson status
Dec 23, 2007
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i didn't read this whole thing but...

1...Hd1p knows his stuff!...he found my first setup and 2 others after that...get a GoFoil you cant lose...ima. GoFoil guy so.i am biased but honestly...no one is ever unhappy with a GoFoil...they get frustrated with the lack of available new stuff but the quality and performance of GoFoil is A+++

2...the Naish 1250 setup is great for prone ... BUT the abracadabra mounting is HORSESH!T... it WILL loosen up on you in the water after a couple waves and ...Naishs do NOT Float!...itll sink straight to the bottom!...i tried one that did that and then owned one that did it too!...and do NOT go up a size... the 1650 is absolute SH!T!...it pumps sortnof but its slooooooowwwwwww...the wave will pass.you by its so slow...i dont know how the hell they sell.that piece of crap with a straight face...i bought the 2020 jet 1650 setup cause i wanted to try it and gave it away to a Naish guy who knows what it is all about because i couldnt feel good about selling it to a newbie...

3...like Hd1p said dont bother with the old cloud 9 stuff...get the new black f series of whatever its called...the shiny black stuff!...

4...AXIS is kikass...i tried it 1.5 years ago and almost jumped ship!

5...cant lose with a GoFoil!
 
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