Red Tip

[stevenewman]

4 years on a Cheyne Horan Winged Keel 6'3 shaped by Gary Linden taught me lateral speed and momentum through whitewater was possible - regardless of surf. That ended in 1989 when technology caught up with hull and thruster designs. On 2/12/05, I surfed 18th street HB on my 6'8" Al Merrick round tail with a new FCS Red Tip fin in 3 to 6 foot surf. WOW! Power, attitude, no loss of speed on rail - all the guts and glory of my old winged keel! Thank you John Harris for taking Cheyne Horan's attitude, Bill Lexcen's ideas, and applying them to a no-nonsense combination of practicality. At age 38 I have the best ride of my 28 years of chasing waves. 2005 has new vigor John!

Steve Newman
Huntington Beach Local

 

[dk]

people here arent big fcs fans...sorry <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/smirk.gif" alt="" />

But sounds cool man! im dying to get my hands on a set myself, but depending on what they go for wholesale i probably never will pony up and pay the large sum. Just because i am not sure i would even use them much.
glad to see your stoked on yours new fins.

people still claim local? <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/confused.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/shocked.gif" alt="" /> <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/cool.gif" alt="" />

 

[SharkBoy]

Don't know why people don't like FCS. I always found 'em handy. It's hard to buy other fins to other fin systems in obscure countries when you are on the road. Glass-ons are definitely better, but FCS is decent for travelling.
But then again, I am no expert <img src="/forum/images/graemlins/socrazy.gif" alt="" />

 

[Halcyon]

Hey HB Local,

I agree, there's nothing like good hold in the white water without loosing good rail to rail transfer.

You got me thinkin' mate. Thanx!

So maybe there is a place for a real winged keel as trailer for a three fin setup. The red tip isn't the same template, foil or configuration as the Lexan/Horan orginial, which I frankly think is a more sound hydrodynamic design than the red-tip.
I built a Mod~Starfin about 6 mouths ago that has possibilities but needs a few generations of developement. I think it may be worthwhile to take some of my original lay-up if I have enough to fashion a real one and see how it goes at about 4.5" or so with a variety of rail fins.

Good Surfin', Rich

 

[TygerH]

Hey Steve glad you like my fin. Cheyne is a good mate of mine and I like his attitude, but please understand I designed this fin a few years before him and Ben Lexen got together. I got the inspiration from Ben's keel fin yacht design, when we beat you guys in the American cup. I had no idea what the yacht one looked like and one day, not that long after the yacht races , I shaped a fin out of a solid block of foam, not sure on the angles, I made it parallel and I glassed it up and put it on a new board. Well that board was electric and my brothers and friends wanted some fins. I was never going to shape another one out of foam , so we made some fibreglass ones and everyone loved them. Multifins got them moulded and sold heaps. This was 83' to about 87'. Tails got too thin for finboxes and I forgot about them for a few years till I found one of the old ones when I was moving. I cut some F.C.S. tabs into it and surfed a board I knew and rediscovered the speed, power and control I'd had before. I love them and 22 years down the track I would be stoked if other people got turned onto them as well. I have been working on some other designs to compliment the 3D and also some singles, everything is positive so far, cheers John Harris.

 

[Halcyon]

Hey John,

I agree completely Cheyne's a great guy. A really devoted father not mention a complete genius on a surfboard.

About the red-tip it looks much closer to the keel on Australia II (What a revolutionary piece of nautical engineering that was) than Cheyne and Ben's Starfin. Have you run a fin of the same configuration as theirs to size of the red tip? Just wondering -- seems like it might be a revealing experience.
I have some stock that has the 120 angle in it so I'm gonna give it a go. Having surfed a starfin I can say for sure that cross piece on top of the center fin should gives a positive feeling and with a true foil it's really fast.


California seems kind of far a way for me to work with the FCS R &amp; D crew directly.

Keep up the R &amp; D mate.

Good-on-ya, Rich

 

[TygerH]

Hey Rich, I honestly couldn't tell you what the Australia 11 yacht's Keel fin looked like. I went and had a look at it when they displayed it at the entertainment centre in Sydney a year or so after the event and remember feeling relieved that mine wasn't at all similar. I only got the inspiration from it, from hearing about this winged keel and thought about it on a thruster back fin. I just used my normal back fin template and used concave in the top, so as to make it one unit. Every other fin I've seen has got two fins split at the top including the yacht, although I think it was at a lower angle [flatter] than the fins I've seen.I've been using a 5 and 1/2 inch one five inches up and it's great, like the boards on wheels with power and control, smaller front fins. cheers, J.H.

 

[Halcyon]

Hey J.H.

Thanks for the tip. I'll put it in the works of things to try next time I'm ready to lay up some poly fin panels.

I think there's a place for this type of fin in the performance picture particularly when you have to bust through those mushed out sections. Have you run it in any surf over 8 feet or so?


Is the the concave on the top of the fins you make for yourself perfectly flat one all the way across the top of the fin.
How about the bottom is it pretty much a standard over camber with the cord about a third back off the leading edge?


Good-on-ya, Rich

 

[TygerH]

Rich, yep I've surfed them over 8ft, in Bali at Padang and outside corner, check my website, bit old but has some photos, johnharrissurfboards.com The ones I use are the same as the redtip, maybe a bit rougher protos and of course the redtip. The concave is flat across the top and foiled under, looking from the top. They go really good in solid waves. Stuff in and around the whitewater for me is like a bonus, I always liked the controled power of the carves you can do under the lip and cutbacks. cheers J.H.

 

[Halcyon]

Hey Tyger,

I went over to talk to my buddy Ross at Santa Cruz Fiberglass this morning and had a close look at the Redtip.
The word from him was that the fin tends to stiffen up board action some. Do you find that to be true?

I was startled to find that neither the upper or lower side of the winglet is foiled. -- Just a rounded leading and trailing edge with each side with the arc being flat. Are my eyes decieving me?
Is this the way the original was fashioned?

Hmmm.... Fin surfaces without foil seem a departure from efficient hydrodynamic form.

Mahalo, Rich

 

[TygerH]

Hey Rich, it's changed a bit since the first one. It has never stiffened up the board. I have never tried to reinvent the wheel. The fin has been ridden in all types of surf and all kinds of boards and it does nothing wrong. Faster, looser, more drive and hangs in better. Seems to me there's a lot of experts on these forums, sort of like the ones you find down Kuta[after dark] and the bars on the snowfields at night. Got to love the experts. You buy one fin, stick it in your board, go surfing and then you have a real opinion. My daughters name is Tyger, cheers JH.

 

[Halcyon]

Hey JH,

I completely agree with your observations about experts.

Although I feel I know more than most I'm sure I have much to learn.

Guess the fin has gone through some generations along the way. Looks to me like FCS did the the best they could with what they had. Five will get you ten yours looks different than theirs.

Good Surfin', Rich