Public Shaming

[enframed]

From the pillory to Dunce Cap to The Scarlett Letter to smart phone videos. Public shaming is back in a big way, except here it's a public shaming other members of the public in addition to the public shaming the government, the government shaming the government, or the government shaming the public, or even governments shaming other governments. Lots of it being thrown around.

I'm still undecided whether it's a good or bad thing, for society.

 

[Duffy LaCoronilla]

It’s bad.

 

[GDaddy]

I don't think the reporting of these events is a problem and even if it was it's pointless to fret about it because it's going to continue on regardless of what anyone thinks about it.

I think what the problem is comes down to how people choose to react. Some transgressions are worth getting emotionally excited about and some aren't. As a society we need to come around to the idea of viewing these events in perspective and not in complete isolation of that perspective.

Coercing everyone to repress everything they think which might run counter to their ChiCom social credit score isn't going to stop them from thinking what they think or to somehow turn them into more virtuous people. It will just make everyone more dishonest in their social interactions.

 

[afoaf]

one thing I like to do is to not act shamefully

 

[hammies]

Long term, big picture effect is one of a continued erosion of public trust, not just in institutions but in individuals. End result is nobody really trusts anybody.

 

[GDaddy]

one thing I like to do is to not act shamefully

The things people are getting run out of town for are not sufficiently "shameful" to warrant that kind of outcome.

 

[grapedrink]

The things people are getting run out of town for are not sufficiently "shameful" to warrant that kind of outcome.

Agreed. God forbid somebody tweet "All lives matter". It's basically one step removed from joining a lynch mob nowadays.

 

[Billy Ocean]

one thing I like to do is to not act shamefully

hopefully you never have to deal with a situation in which other people with power have a different idea of what is shameful than you do

 

[Billy Ocean]

From the pillory to Dunce Cap to The Scarlett Letter to smart phone videos. Public shaming is back in a big way, except here it's a public shaming other members of the public in addition to the public shaming the government, the government shaming the government, or the government shaming the public, or even governments shaming other governments. Lots of it being thrown around.

I'm still undecided whether it's a good or bad thing, for society.

scarlet letter is a nice example

Puritanical tendencies take many forms

 

[enframed]

hopefully you never have to deal with a situation in which other people with power have a different idea of what is shameful than you do

One could say that our smart phones + the internet have led to the "democratization of shame."

Also, if you happen to be in a doom metal band, you can use "Democratization of Shame" as your album title, gratis.

 

[Billy Ocean]

One could say that our smart phones + the internet have led to the "democratization of shame."

its much worse than 1600s Massachusetts

at least then, it people knew you personally

they had to call you a witch to your face and deal with any actual conflict that resulted

Now they can just ruin you anonymously

it’s like a video game

 

[enframed]

I dunno. I mean, the "shameful event" is between two people, at least: the one filming and the one being filmed, and any incidentals. The difference is now, rather than your village, the entire fvcking world knows what you did. The power dynamic is different now. The power to shame no longer rests solely in the state, hence my use of "democratization."

 

[Autoprax]

Appeals to shame are not bad when the person is acting shamefully.

You can also misuse appeals to shame for personal gain.

Filming people and posting online is an aggressive act and should be shamed.

The best test for shame would to ask the question "If everyone did that behavior could the society still function?"

In certain ways we have dropped the ball on shaming.

This trend of incivility should have been shamed.

But it takes a village.

 

[Autoprax]

hopefully you never have to deal with a situation in which other people with power have a different idea of what is shameful than you do

I been doing that all my life.

Life is a tightrope.

My book is about responding to aggression in a way that others cannot use against you.

There are things you can do.

But first you must increase your awareness within the complex domain that is conflict in the social environment.

 

[Sharkbiscuit]

its much worse than 1600s Massachusetts

Yeah, lots of people have been put to death.

 

[enframed]

Long term, big picture effect is one of a continued erosion of public trust, not just in institutions but in individuals. End result is nobody really trusts anybody.

That's a bleak view.

Does anyone think that the thought that we could be publicly shamed might change our behavior for the better? Eventually? This is still new. Maybe it needs time to get into our bones.

 

[Autoprax]

That's a bleak view.

Does anyone think that the thought that we could be publicly shamed might change our behavior for the better? Eventually? This is still new. Maybe it needs time to get into our bones.

Most people are behaving.

 

[enframed]

Most people are behaving.

Yes, I know. Do you have any thoughts on the actual question. I'll be more clear: do you think people with a propensity to behave in ways that are being outed publicly as shameful might learn to control themselves better/behave differently knowing this is a possible result of their behavior. Not right now, perhaps, but over time. Do you think the people being publicly shamed now will learn anything from these experiences?

 

[Autoprax]

Yes, I know. Do you have any thoughts on the actual question. I'll be more clear: do you think people with a propensity to behave in ways that are being outed publicly as shameful might learn to control themselves better/behave differently knowing this is a possible result of their behavior. Not right now, perhaps, but over time. Do you think the people being publicly shamed now will learn anything from these experiences?

Maybe.

Some might.

Some won't.

The problem with this shaming trend is that shame is being used tactically in bad faith on both teams.

So the positive adaptation you would like to result from the shaming probably won't happen at a noticeable level.

PS, you don't have to take the tone with me.

 

[mundus]

The people who need shaming the most generally are impossible to shame.