Mental Health thread

estreet

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It’s good that you’re not one of the people feels shame when they fail
And they don’t try because they’re rather not feel shame
Knowing that learning though mistakes and missteps is so freeing.
But if as a kid you were indoctrinated that failure is shameful, it’s hard to believe you’re not
I'm shameless because I reported failure? Maybe I just value honesty.
 

Kento

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Last year there was a guy who did the 5K in a wheelchair and then came back the next day to do the half marathon. Not a smooth track either, got some uphills (ramps) to go with it. He was working it. Very worthy of admiration.

Goggins is entertaining. It's more tough love and stop making excuses. I guess you can be motivated by that but like grapedrink said above, if you're already driven, it's peripheral at best.

Vince Lombardi nailed it on the other hand, the greatest motivation by far is fear. Whatever you're scared of, you might lose your job, that outside set is coming and you really don't want to wear it on the head, etc., whatever it is, that will push you to dig really damn deep. And Goggins is right about the 60% rule - that even when you think you're done, you still have another 60% in the tank. Suffering is good for the soul. And what he glosses over is that you pay for dipping into that tank; make it worth it.

I apparently had Medium Covid last week and running 14 miles at about 8:30 pace last Saturday, while clearing my sinuses that's for sure, killed my joints. Couldn't even run until yesterday but the 10K felt good, smooth. Waiting for the heat to go down (currently 89 degrees out) and then jog a nice 12 miles or so. Marathon in 3 weeks but so long as don't overdo it, should be good. Goal is to keep it under 8 minute pace (7:35 would be nice but we'll see), finish under 3:30.
 
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grapedrink

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We fundamentally change our behavior by deliberatly (or indeliberatly for that matter) conditioning ourselves in a particular way, right? The question is, can we deliberatly condition ourselves to endure sustained discomfort, or to put it your way, can we condition ourselves so that we require less will-power, or vertually no will-power, for anything we put our mind to. I don't see why not, though it may take more or less time to condition ourselves depending on the activity and perhaps other factors.
I think most of us are capable of improving ourselves and raising our threshold of what we can endure. What I'm not convinced of is if this type of motivation is actually sustainable over the long term for most people. IMO we are all born with a certain amount of drive and ability to be consistent, and over time most of us revert back to our own mean.

Which is why I think that the Goggins-type motivation can work on a lot of people at first, but over an extended time horizon the only people who it amps up are the people who would are already consistent in the first place, much of whom would be that way without it.
 

estreet

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IMO we are all born with a certain amount of drive and ability to be consistent, and over time most of us revert back to our own mean.
No one would argue that Goggins story isn't exceptional. And again you seem to be contradicting yourself a bit. If Sally is born with a fixed drive of 5.743 and a consistency of 4.874 then that is her limit. She would be incapable of exceeding that limit, much less sustain a higher limit. You can't revert back to a level if you're incapable of exceeding it in the first place.
 

Random Guy

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I think most of us are capable of improving ourselves and raising our threshold of what we can endure. What I'm not convinced of is if this type of motivation is actually sustainable over the long term for most people. IMO we are all born with a certain amount of drive and ability to be consistent, and over time most of us revert back to our own mean.

Which is why I think that the Goggins-type motivation can work on a lot of people at first, but over an extended time horizon the only people who it amps up are the people who would are already consistent in the first place, much of whom would be that way without it.
No one would argue that Goggins story isn't exceptional. And again you seem to be contradicting yourself a bit. If Sally is born with a fixed drive of 5.743 and a consistency of 4.874 then that is her limit. She would be incapable of exceeding that limit, much less sustain a higher limit. You can't revert back to a level if you're incapable of exceeding it in the first place.
I think you should both just say that I pretty much nailed it, with good examples, and say you both agree with me
and then move on to the next thing
 
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grapedrink

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No one would argue that Goggins story isn't exceptional. And again you seem to be contradicting yourself a bit. If Sally is born with a fixed drive of 5.743 and a consistency of 4.874 then that is her limit. She would be incapable of exceeding that limit, much less sustain a higher limit. You can't revert back to a level if you're incapable of exceeding it in the first place.
Uh, yeah, that's exactly what I'm saying. We have some capacity to move up to suit a specific goal, but for the average person it takes an incredible amount of will power to sustain a huge increase over time. We may get a boost for a while but over time most of us go back to our natural level. Whereas the people who can operate in the 8-10 range don't need Goggins.
 

estreet

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We have some capacity to move up to suit a specific goal, but for the average person it takes an incredible amount of will power to sustain a huge increase over time.
Your term “move up” is rather vague. It seems to me that the core of this is enduring discomfort. Anyone can endure discomfort. Anyone can develop a greater tolerance for it. There’s nothing special about it. I can’t imagine why some people would be born with a limited ability to tolerate discomfort or pain, or lack the ability to condition themselves to work through it. I can easily see culture putting the clamps down though.

Where’d I put my sunglasses? :cool:

 

grapedrink

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Your term “move up” is rather vague. It seems to me that the core of this is enduring discomfort. Anyone can endure discomfort. Anyone can develop a greater tolerance for it. There’s nothing special about it. I can’t imagine why some people would be born with a limited ability to tolerate discomfort or pain, or lack the ability to condition themselves to work through it. I can easily see culture putting the clamps down though.

Where’d I put my sunglasses? :cool:

Again- it’s the ability to endure discomfort on a consistent basis over time. Most people can rally for a specific goal, but over extended time most will drop out and go back to their mean because they don’t have that sort of drive in them. I’m not convinced that you most can be trained to have that. Pretty sure I’ve made that clarifying statement at least half dozen times now :foreheadslap:

Kind of like how gyms are the most crowded in January when everyone makes their New Year’s resolution, then by March it’s back to normal traffic. If you didn’t have the drive before an external motivator, then an external motivator is only going to push you so far.
 

Random Guy

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the mental health thread is different than other threads. It’s where people can talk about their mental health and where people can be supportive
The rest of the erbb, with a few exceptions, is for bickering
This has been a public service announcement
 

estreet

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Again- it’s the ability to endure discomfort on a consistent basis over time. Most people can rally for a specific goal, but over extended time most will drop out and go back to their mean because they don’t have that sort of drive in them. I’m not convinced that you most can be trained to have that. Pretty sure I’ve made that clarifying statement at least half dozen times now
I’m not convinced either, hence our friendly chat. Discussing the issue is helpful, for me, to think through it. Apparently it disturbs some others though. I guess we’ll have to stop. I thought it was appropriate here since it’s a psychological issue that I’m trying to work through.

Kind of like how gyms are the most crowded in January when everyone makes their New Year’s resolution, then by March it’s back to normal traffic. If you didn’t have the drive before an external motivator, then an external motivator is only going to push you so far.
That’s a good point and I wanted to bring this up earlier. I’ve been going to gyms regularly my entire adult life. It requires zero willpower. In fact I like working out. It’s nearly inconceivable to me that people could dislike it. Anyway, people think I’m disciplined because I stay in shape. It doesn’t feel like discipline at all, and I’m disturbingly undisciplined in other areas, namely work, and that’s a problem. If staying in shape can be so engrained in my conditioning shouldn’t I be able to condition myself similarly in other areas?