REMINDER: THE ARENA PLATFORM, INC. has no obligation to monitor the Forums. However, THE ARENA PLATFORM, INC. reserves the right to review any materials submitted to or posted on the Forums, and remove, delete, redact or otherwise modify such materials, in its sole discretion and for any reason whatsoever, at any time and from time to time, without notice or further obligation to you. THE ARENA PLATFORM, INC. has no obligation to display or post any materials provided by you. THE ARENA PLATFORM, INC. reserves the right to disclose, at any time and from time to time, any information or materials that we deem necessary or appropriate to satisfy any applicable law, regulation, contract obligation, legal or dispute process or government request. Click on the following hyperlinks to further read the applicable Privacy Policy and Terms of Use.
Knee arthritis
- Thread starter Random Guy
- Start date
I think VonMeister is trying to say that your pain levels are subjective based on your perception of injury and damage. If the doctor told you that, he made your pain worse. Also, orthopedic surgeons get paid when they do a surgery. In my experience, they have an antiquated understanding of pain. Is this your doctor?
If you believe the sound you heard in your knee meant you damaged your knee, your pain could easily go from a 2 to an 8, especially if you believe your MCL is hanging by a thread. However, you had no MRI before the fall off the horse or before you heard that sound, so you have no way of knowing whether your MCL and meniscus are worse now than they were before.
My friend is the top spine surgeon in his area and he says there's nothing to operate on for most of the patients that present with spine pain. He refers them to pain care or rehab.
Oh I hear you on that- this pain went from a 2 to an 8 well before I saw any doctor whatsoever, that was just my own scale to give perspective. I didn’t even think “damn there goes the meniscus” it was a simple matter of standing up, and my annoying but manageable knee pain exploded into a severe and sustained pain that made walking possible only by dragging my entire right leg behind me like a zombie-extra in the walking dead taking his role a little too seriously.
That was Tuesday. Didn’t see a doc until yesterday. He was concerned by the swelling in multiple areas, all the fluid build up he could see just from the x ray, and of course the simple fact that a 6 week old minor knee aggravation not only didn’t improve, but worsened dramatically after more than a month of resting it
That was Tuesday. Didn’t see a doc until yesterday. He was concerned by the swelling in multiple areas, all the fluid build up he could see just from the x ray, and of course the simple fact that a 6 week old minor knee aggravation not only didn’t improve, but worsened dramatically after more than a month of resting it
I tore meniscus in my knee years ago. In my case there was no pain. The problem was that with the tear, there was apparently a flap of meniscus that would fold over and jam the knee not allowing full range of motion. I was told there was no way that could heal. Orthoscopic surgery (the three hole punch) and this surgeon used a laser to trim the meniscus. Weirdly they also found a pea shaped bone fragment in my knee. Doc said he'd never seen that before. Anyway, I met 4 NFL offensive lineman in his waiting room and was walking the day of surgery. Surfing in a week. But, I'm left with what I believe to be scar tissue from the surgery. Unless I am stretching it/working it through full motion range it starts getting tight as the angle tightens. Every surgery I have had always leaves some sort of deficit.
Did you get the fluid drained?
THat helped me pretty immediately
Actually, it hurt like a mfer, but felt better after
If that was a response about draining fluid, that’s just a syringe.
They just sucked out a couple of cups of some undisclosed kind of fluid
AFAIK the meniscus just goes bad on most people like the rotator cuffs and it’s not a problem. It makes you wonder why do surgery if you’re going to end up with the same ROM afterwards as before. I had surgery on a toe joint and wouldn’t say my ROM is really improved as promised. But hey I kept the surgeon employed.
Yeah I agree, I view surgery as a last resort type of thing if possible. Surgeons wanna cut, it’s what they do. Hammer always sees a nail and so forth…But, I have also heard that an injured/ruptured meniscus (if that’s what this is) is a very quick surgical fix with minimal couch time afterwards. We’ll see what dr Leung says on Tuesday
Exactly.
Letting a patient walk away with this perception is malpractice.
he cut me ahead of the rest of the days mri‘s to get me scoped STAT (literally written in the order lol), to see how bad the damage is to both the mcl AND the meniscus. He thinks it very well may be both, and could be pretty bad.
....especially considering there are plenty of people walking around pain free with torn MCL and meniscus. The only time surgery would be necessary for a torn MCL would be if there were joint instability...which if there were subway's doc would have had the knee immobilized to prevent further damage to the soft tissues of the joint and after a period if immobilization there was no improvement. Complications from MCL tears are so uncommon they aren't worth discussing with a patient. They generally heal very well on their own.
The meniscus is a bit more troublesome and depending on the degree it could warrant surgery. It is highly likely that a meniscus tear will heal on it's own but if there is no improvement in a short timeframe an MRI and perhaps surgical intervention could be necessary based on the findings of the MRI. I tore my meniscus in 1994 and it healed on it's own but it was a partial tear and I was in my 20's and as in good of shape as a human could be at that point.
Yeah I tore my left mcl pretty badly in 2018. Surgery never came up, but even with a lot of pt and heat and rest it still took months to feel normal. Had that weird wobbly feeling for months… But that pain overall, even the first 24 after the injury, was a mosquito bite compared to what I was feeling Tuesday though Saturday. The swelling and pain has now lessened encouragingly this weekend after a solid 4 days of rest and minimal movement
The improvement is a good sign. Keep in mind pain is a terrible indicator of injury severity.
How is the range of motion? Not with respect to pain but can you force a full range of motion (better to guess here than aggravate it by trying).
If it were me I would rest it for a few days until walking normal wasn't excruciating. At that point I would walk and just try and do things that challenge the knee just to the point the pain would be considered annoying. Movement is your best medicine but not so much that you keep it aggravated but there's no rehab without some bit of manageable pain.
Speaking of medicine. People never take enough. A therapeutic dose of ibuprofen to treat swelling is going to be minimum of 2400mg per day and will take several days to be effective. I would try and alternate acetaminophen and ibuprofen every 3 hours or so and see where that takes you. When I was dealing with my shoulder I the acute phase I was taking 600mg ibuprofen every 6 hours and 900mg acetaminophen every 6 hours, alternating them so I was taking something every three hours. You could take them together but I chose to do it that way.
imsaw dr price in the same practice, going off your docs name
id seen him about rando items in my elbow before. hes never suggested surgery and I’ve always gotten better
that practice seems like they’re making plenty of money without unnecessary surgeries to pay the bills
i used to wait forever every time I had an appointment
but the 2 times I went for my knee I was in and out amazingly quickly
somehow it’s been efficient without feeling rushed
the doctor has someone doing all the computer stuff as the doc is examining or talking to me, which is way better than the doc focused on the computer screen
i hope your experiences there are as good
maybe it’s not the same place
id seen him about rando items in my elbow before. hes never suggested surgery and I’ve always gotten better
that practice seems like they’re making plenty of money without unnecessary surgeries to pay the bills
i used to wait forever every time I had an appointment
but the 2 times I went for my knee I was in and out amazingly quickly
somehow it’s been efficient without feeling rushed
the doctor has someone doing all the computer stuff as the doc is examining or talking to me, which is way better than the doc focused on the computer screen
i hope your experiences there are as good
maybe it’s not the same place
doc Leung and I had a look at the mri today. Even I could see the ruptured parts of the meniscus. Mcl was strained and swollen in one part but not too badly. Some bone bruising, bunch of fluid build up, and a dash of early arthritic signs that he said would likely never really trouble me. So we are trying rest and pt for a month, see if the meniscus does some healing on its own. if it’s still holding me back from surfing and carpendieming in a month, then we think about surgery. I was happy with that approach. Doc said it was already a good sign that my pain levels had dropped so far in just a few days staying mostly off it. But then he showed me the scans lol
it was cool looking at the mri. He was like, see this little triangle here? I call it the bow tie. That’s the unharmed end, or cross section I think he said, of your meniscus. Switched the frame. See this? Points to a vageluey triangular blob of various shades of white and gray. He’s like, that’s the other end, and it’s supposed to look like the first one I showed you. It’s all torn up. See this big weird vaguely oval shaped area up on top of your knee? That’s all the fluid build up from the injuries.
But he did consult with a sports surgeon, one of those types who probably always wants to cut a man before trying PT, and he agreed that a month of rest and pt is a good start, and may do the trick, or at least get me on my way fast enough that surgery wont be necessary. If I were to be couch bound for 6 months? Cut me open and fix it up doc. But a month I can do. Even two really. Plenty of PT. limit my days in the city (swear to god, even if I don’t go anywhere but the office and back, I still end up logging 3 miles on my feet just commuting and walking around the office) so anyway, that’s where it’s at. Pain levels are low to nonexistent, so I reckon if I just take care of it and don’t do anything stupid I’ll be fine a month or two
should have seen the size of the syringe he used to shoot my knee full of a mixture of novaCaine and steroids. I was like “doc that’s not a syringe it’s a fucking stiletto.” But I watched. Didn’t really hurt but sure looked gnarly. He had to sink that thing hilt deep, no gay code intended.
it was cool looking at the mri. He was like, see this little triangle here? I call it the bow tie. That’s the unharmed end, or cross section I think he said, of your meniscus. Switched the frame. See this? Points to a vageluey triangular blob of various shades of white and gray. He’s like, that’s the other end, and it’s supposed to look like the first one I showed you. It’s all torn up. See this big weird vaguely oval shaped area up on top of your knee? That’s all the fluid build up from the injuries.
But he did consult with a sports surgeon, one of those types who probably always wants to cut a man before trying PT, and he agreed that a month of rest and pt is a good start, and may do the trick, or at least get me on my way fast enough that surgery wont be necessary. If I were to be couch bound for 6 months? Cut me open and fix it up doc. But a month I can do. Even two really. Plenty of PT. limit my days in the city (swear to god, even if I don’t go anywhere but the office and back, I still end up logging 3 miles on my feet just commuting and walking around the office) so anyway, that’s where it’s at. Pain levels are low to nonexistent, so I reckon if I just take care of it and don’t do anything stupid I’ll be fine a month or two
should have seen the size of the syringe he used to shoot my knee full of a mixture of novaCaine and steroids. I was like “doc that’s not a syringe it’s a fucking stiletto.” But I watched. Didn’t really hurt but sure looked gnarly. He had to sink that thing hilt deep, no gay code intended.
How’s the knee @Subway?
ive been doing the sled pulls and split squats since this thread and I’m almost back to normal
i just checked for pain and range of motion and I feel just a bit of discomfort in a full kneel / squat on my toes
i ran the other night for a quarter mile or so and no pain the next day ( caught in thunderstorm and the lightning was too close for comfort
surfed last Saturday and the knee was not an issue
(ran into senor stocked and junior stocked in the lot)
thanks for the knees over toes suggestion gws
ill never know if it helps or I would’ve gotten better anyway, but I’m way better so that’s all that matters
not sure when to get back to deadlifts and real squats
ive been doing the sled pulls and split squats since this thread and I’m almost back to normal
i just checked for pain and range of motion and I feel just a bit of discomfort in a full kneel / squat on my toes
i ran the other night for a quarter mile or so and no pain the next day ( caught in thunderstorm and the lightning was too close for comfort
surfed last Saturday and the knee was not an issue
(ran into senor stocked and junior stocked in the lot)
thanks for the knees over toes suggestion gws
ill never know if it helps or I would’ve gotten better anyway, but I’m way better so that’s all that matters
not sure when to get back to deadlifts and real squats