Gas powered vehicles -DONE

[VonMeister]

Tesla's are perfect daily drivers. My wife is in and out of the house all day. In between trips it gets plugged in.......can make it to Disneyland and back on a single charge. It's a unique driving experience and by far better than anything else you're going to buy as a daily driver. Maintenance is very low and you never have to stop for gas.

The hurdle to batteries is lifecycle and charging. They take too long to charge and lose about 5% capacity per year. Also it's not just starting the car on fire by charging to fast...the faster you charge them the faster batteries degrade. Unless you believe in perpetual motion you know neither is going to get much better. To totally replace the IC engine a completely different energy source is going to be needed.

California is not going to outlaw IC engines. It's just more shouting from Sacramento.

 

[Sharkbiscuit]

new fence?!

That looks like another place. I actually think I may have discussed football with the owner several times during a visit. I asked if the guy was still around, but they told me his place up on the hill was built and he hangs out at home now. Then I realized I was asking those kinds of questions and STFU. The trip was much less....herbally seasoned than the time we rapped and yapped about football.

5/7; lefthander in sight either way. Ogro low-key flexing with the shot not from the tourist/general admission angle.

 

[ElOgro]

I am normally the only person I see on a bus down there who is not Mexican.

I used to work in Ponte Vedra Beach March 2013-March2016. I saw a shitload of BMW, Audi, Mercedes get traded in for Teslas. The ATP Americas (Tennis) and PGA HQ are within a mile of each other and the place is rich Tumper central.

They don't give a f--k about Global Warming. They're buying Teslas because they can seat 4 and blow Corvettes the f--k away in stoplight drag races. For starters.

What I said was those that can afford not to, don’t don’t ride the bus. The big upswing in personal transportation ownership was around 15 years ago.

Hey, I’m an advocate. Needs to be affordable. I hope it is in 15 years.

 

[ElOgro]

new fence?!

Not here sb should know where.

 

[ElOgro]

Tesla's are perfect daily drivers. My wife is in and out of the house all day. In between trips it gets plugged in.......can make it to Disneyland and back on a single charge. It's a unique driving experience and by far better than anything else you're going to buy as a daily driver. Maintenance is very low and you never have to stop for gas.

The hurdle to batteries is lifecycle and charging. They take too long to charge and lose about 5% capacity per year. Also it's not just starting the car on fire by charging to fast...the faster you charge them the faster batteries degrade. Unless you believe in perpetual motion you know neither is going to get much better. To totally replace the IC engine a completely different energy source is going to be needed.

California is not going to outlaw IC engines. It's just more shouting from Sacramento.

All that.

Edit: What does that add to your electric bill monthly?

 

[PRCD]

Tesla's are perfect daily drivers. My wife is in and out of the house all day. In between trips it gets plugged in.......can make it to Disneyland and back on a single charge. It's a unique driving experience and by far better than anything else you're going to buy as a daily driver. Maintenance is very low and you never have to stop for gas.

The hurdle to batteries is lifecycle and charging. They take too long to charge and lose about 5% capacity per year. Also it's not just starting the car on fire by charging to fast...the faster you charge them the faster batteries degrade. Unless you believe in perpetual motion you know neither is going to get much better. To totally replace the IC engine a completely different energy source is going to be needed.

California is not going to outlaw IC engines. It's just more shouting from Sacramento.

Excellent thank you. 5% capacity per year is a big loss which means you need to replace the battery about 5-6 years in. This adds significantly to the cost of ownership. The improvements I described above might help with this. The SAW filter idea came from academia which means it's probably DOA. The average car on the road is 10 years old. Both of mine are 10 years old. I just looked at a Chevy Volt and its interior is tiny compared to my hatchback Honda Fit which can fit my entire family of 5. The cargo capacity on the VOlt is nil. I suspect this has something to do with the fact that it's lugging around a 1500 lb battery.

Obviously Mr. Fusion is not going to be invented soon. The future promised by "Back to the Future" looks more and more like the sequel where Bif Tannen is president (wait a minute...) without the flying cars running on fusion.

 

[Sharkbiscuit]

5% capacity per year sounds like jack sh!t. 500 mile range down to...350 mile range, at worst?

The Volt is a very early example of the tech. The average BMW/Audi/Mercedes that's 10 years old is not exactly a low cost of ownership proposition.

The Teslas available today aren't competing with Accords and Camrys and Maximas.

 

[plasticbertrand]

Yeah, Teslas are popular with the same people who shop at Whole Paycheck.

It's alarming how little the Cloud People understand those outside their bubble.

What's alarming is how little faith you have in American ingenuity.

Every new technology is expensive in the begining.

The electric car and battery technology will trickle down sooner than the billionaire tax cuts. (never)

 

[plasticbertrand]

Excellent thank you. 5% capacity per year is a big loss which means you need to replace the battery about 5-6 years in.

You drive 100,000 miles a year?

Your math is way off.

Tesla batteries are good for 1500 charging cycles, which will get you 300k-500k miles depending on your driving style and charging habits.

Considering low/no maintenance and low running costs, replacing a battery after 300k miles is cheaper than rebuilding a transmission or the motor.

 

[Sharkbiscuit]

What's alarming is how little faith you have in American ingenuity.

Every new technology is expensive in the begining.

The electric car and battery technology will trickle down sooner than the billionaire tax cuts. (never)

Maybe in California it's different, but in North/Central Florida, it's all upper middle class + Republicans with Teslas. I would concur that these people are largely clueless and don't know sh!t about anything outside their comfort zones.

 

[JBerry]

It’s not even close to 5% per year! Way less! That may be a high number IF you are fully charging it every single charge, which you shouldn’t do. Tesla’s batteries are designed to last 10k(not sure of this number)? Full charging cycles. So if you only charge 75% each time, you are banking 25% and adding that to the amount of charges you have so (10k goes to 12.5-15k?) or whatever the charges remain of charging cycles.

when my wife was commuting to work daily and we charged at home, we avg about 50$ per month extra bill. Which equates to about $20 per full tank(charge).
then switched to charging at work for $3/per day once a week full, and our bill at home dropped and only charge from work $12/month.
then we noticed we actually had free supercharging, for whatever reason it didn’t show up when we bought, so it only takes about 30-40 mins to fully charge 310 miles.

also, barely use the brakes, I mean barely. Over air WiFi updates constantly keep system updated w all the goods. So about the only thing need maintenance wise is refilling washer fluid and rotating or changing tires. How much is that worth?$$$

 

[PRCD]

5% capacity per year sounds like jack sh!t. 500 mile range down to...350 mile range, at worst?

The long range Model S does 370 miles. After 5 years, that's below 300.

The Volt is a very early example of the tech.

In what way?

The average BMW/Audi/Mercedes that's 10 years old is not exactly a low cost of ownership proposition.

The Teslas available today aren't competing with Accords and Camrys and Maximas.

Right. Teslas are the luxury market. The owners can afford high cost of ownership and are the same people who traded in their BMWs/Audis/Mercedes like you said. Look at the feedback ITT: "the Tesla is a hotrod!" That's the market: luxury hotrod.

 

[JBerry]

Haha it is a hotrod, the model 3 is that’s for sure.
I don’t know, wife didn’t buy a new car for 13 years. Saved for it a bit. Got a good loan rate. Made it happen. Haven’t spent a dime on it maintenance wise only payment.
Got in early and got the $10k tax credit! Which was amazing btw. And save over $150/mo on fuel vs charging.
So the $50k total dropped to $38k there’s nothing in that price range even close to it. Volt? Bolt? Prius? Any other hybrid? Pfffft! Split with those crap cars, for us it was a no brainer.
And if you compare it to the bmw Audi Volvo etc, the mid upper luxury car, IMO it blows doors on them too.
you really do just need to drive one and not be so scared of it. It’s revolutionary and will blow your mind!

 

[PRCD]

Haha it is a hotrod, the model 3 is that’s for sure.
I don’t know, wife didn’t buy a new car for 13 years. Saved for it a bit. Got a good loan rate. Made it happen. Haven’t spent a dime on it maintenance wise only payment.
Got in early and got the $10k tax credit! Which was amazing btw. And save over $150/mo on fuel vs charging.
So the $50k total dropped to $38k there’s nothing in that price range even close to it. Volt? Bolt? Prius? Any other hybrid? Pfffft! Split with those crap cars, for us it was a no brainer.

You are making my point. This is a luxury car that comes with a $10k upper middle class subsidy. Proles don't get this. Where's the $10k credit for the middle-class family looking to buy a similarly-priced Honda minivan, or even a Mazda MP5?

 

[Sharkbiscuit]

You are making my point. This is a luxury car that comes with a $10k upper middle class subsidy. Proles don't get this. Where's the $10k credit for the middle-class family looking to buy a similarly-priced Honda minivan, or even a Mazda MP5?

It's now $7.5k, the same as for the electric Ford Focus EV. Or some Honda, Hyundai, literally Kias....

I will assume your point is that you have no idea what you are talking about, and yes, you and the other poster made that point quite clear.

Tax Incentives

Find out how you can save money through Federal tax incentives on your purchase of a new plug-in hybrid or electric vehicle!

www.fueleconomy.gov

 

[Billy Ocean]

You are making my point. This is a luxury car that comes with a $10k upper middle class subsidy. Proles don't get this. Where's the $10k credit for the middle-class family looking to buy a similarly-priced Honda minivan, or even a Mazda MP5?

they want the plebs to be dependent on riding public transportation which can support thousands of clerk pensions

 

[PRCD]

It's now $7.5k, the same as for the electric Ford Focus EV. Or some Honda, Hyundai, literally Kias....

I will assume your point is that you have no idea what you are talking about, and yes, you and the other poster made that point quite clear.

Tax Incentives

Find out how you can save money through Federal tax incentives on your purchase of a new plug-in hybrid or electric vehicle!

www.fueleconomy.gov

I noticed the Ford Focus EV has been discontinued. Most of the cars I saw on that list were luxury brands. I see very few EVs from prole brands on the road. Mostly, the owners of Chevy Volts are pot growers trying to get cut-rate power.

The credit begins to phase out for vehicles at the beginning of the second calendar quarter after the manufacturer has sold 200,000 eligible plug-in electric vehicles (i.e., plug-in hybrids and EVs) in the United States as counted from January 1, 2010. IRS will announce when a manufacturer exceeds this production figure and will announce the subsequent phase out schedule (Plug-In Electric Drive Motor Vehicle Credit Quarterly Sales).

Great, so this is essentially an unsustainable subsidy grab by certain manufacturers, particularly of luxury brands. Tesla's consumer-side subsidies have been phased-out:


They're still not profitable after 10 years, so it remains a taxpayer-subsidized luxury brand on the development side:

The solid sales number was good news for those hoping that Tesla would be able to maintain its path of profitability despite the Covid-19 pandemic. Tesla's stock, which had been up 6% in premarket trading before the sales and production release, climbed even higher on the news.

they want the plebs to be dependent on riding public transportation which can support thousands of clerk pensions

Out here, public transportation doesn't go anywhere. It was all dismantled 100 years ago in favor of the automobile. We also built sprawling suburbs far away from work. It's not like Bawstun that was built on a human scale hundreds of years ago.

Telling the rest of us to use public transportation is just another form of, "Let them eat cake."

 

[One-Off]

The front end and headlights on that thing are hideous looking.

Didn't we used to have a throw-up emoji?

We agree on something! It reminds me of a character from a "Cars" Pixar movie. The Tesla truck I might eventually get used to.

 

[JBerry]

You are making my point. This is a luxury car that comes with a $10k upper middle class subsidy. Proles don't get this. Where's the $10k credit for the middle-class family looking to buy a similarly-priced Honda minivan, or even a Mazda MP5?

Thank you! Really anyone that could afford it at the time could have got the tax break. Upper middle
Lower class. We looked at another suv of all types and aside from a Kia Hyundai all were 50$k or more. The credit was for EVs only. All manufactures that make evs have the credit, their evs just aren’t as popular and that’s why they still have max credits avail. When someone makes an ev minivan, I’m sure you’ll be the first on the list! And you’ll get that tax credit too! And I totally agree,
Where is the credit for the mid class family mini van or similar? That’s lame just as well! Ask the Congress!

 

[afoaf]

Mostly, the owners of Chevy Volts are pot growers trying to get cut-rate power.

this is what desperation looks like

EV tech is going in to luxury cars because that's where the margins are

every manufacturer is scaling up to drive down costs and crack open the lower price points

I'll give you credit for not making weird bible references though