Father and son charged in Ahmaud Arbery’s murder.

hal9000

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Given the current status of local, national and world events, race baiting threads really don't interest me. I'm sure as we get closer to November and as the Corona scare dies down the democrats and the media will do their best to create as much racial division as they can as it is the #1 play in their re-election playbook. Perhaps they can stage a riot and some looting in a few democrat run cities again.
spoken like a true nazi.
 
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GWS_2

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That's beyond ridiculous.

Letting the guilty go free so that the wrongfully convicted don't go to prison?

Some logic.

How about build in the feature where the guilty don't get set free and the innocent don't get the chair?

Ever thought of that feature?
Read this.

FYI, I did NOT write it.


Blackstone's Ratio or Blackstone's Formulation

Among the most well-known of Blackstone's contributions to judicial theory is his own statement of the principle that it "is better that ten guilty persons escape than that one innocent suffer"

While this argument originates at least as far back as Genesis 18:23–32 in the Bible, as well as versions by Maimonides and Sir John Fortescue,[121] Blackstone's analysis is the one picked up by Benjamin Franklin and others, so that the term has become known as "Blackstone's Ratio".

As John Adams, having studied Blackstone, put it:


It is more important that innocence should be protected, than it is, that guilt be punished; for guilt and crimes are so frequent in this world, that all of them cannot be punished.... when innocence itself, is brought to the bar and condemned, especially to die, the subject will exclaim, 'it is immaterial to me whether I behave well or ill, for virtue itself is no security.' And if such a sentiment as this were to take hold in the mind of the subject that would be the end of all security whatsoever.
Blackstone's Ratio is a maxim of English law, having been established as such within a few decades of Blackstone's work being published. It is also cited in courts and law in the US, and is strongly emphasized to American law students."
________________________________

The concept is a basic tenant of US Law.
 

GWS_2

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In it's essence its the same exact approach to the COVID pandemic that is often ridiculed and mocked; "if it saves just one life".
I think you are straining the bounds of ridiculous with that, but it is what it is. The concept was built into our system from inception. It makes a lot of sense. And I'm the guy whose sister was premeditatedly murdered by a guy our government later set free.

There is bite to the concept. But in an imperfect world the concept has validity. If you ever wind up in court accused of a crime you are innocent of, you'll get it I'm sure.
 

mundus

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In it's essence its the same exact approach to the COVID pandemic that is often ridiculed and mocked; "if it saves just one life".
Also this principle is not in effect, Re death penalty in which we know innocents have been executed.
 

manbearpig

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If 10 guilty individuals are released to save just one innocent person is saved from wrongful conviction isn't that far off from if widespread, mandated social distancing is implemented if just one person is saved from a world wide pandemic. It's not so loony when you take into consideration the current climate, unprecedented nature of it and the worldwide aspect.

I don't necessary disagree with either concept, tough choices need to be made and its these tough times that separate the men from the boys. There's aspects of the current events that I agree with and disagree with. But we have quite a bit more control over our judicial system than a virus, and we can clearly do better at avoiding release and absolving clearly guilty individuals. Nor do I think we should really be turning a blind eye to civilian vigilantes when you consider the outcome it often has. We don't have to throw in the towel and say 'well those 10 guilty individuals got away scot-free but we may have avoided one innocent person being prosecuted.' It doesn't make sense.
 

GWS_2

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We don't have to throw in the towel and say 'well those 10 guilty individuals got away scot-free but we may have avoided one innocent person being prosecuted.' It doesn't make sense.
IMO, you're really struggling with the attempted COVID analogy.

The above... I don't understand what you don't understand. The concept is very simple. It makes perfect sense. Out of curiosity, keeping in mind that no legal system is perfect and there will always be convicted innocent and those that escape justice, how would you fix things? Give me a specific. Not a generalization.

By the way, this bias in our system used to be something that liberals were huge champions of. You're talking more like a 70's "law and order" Republican. Just saying...
 
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manbearpig

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I'm not a an expert of law, so while I recognize there are problems with our judicial system asking for a specific detailed analysis of how to fix it probably isn't going to happen from me on a Sunday morning while I work on construction details. It's not really my wheelhouse, but it's easy to recognize its shortcomings. Like you said, no system is perfect and never will be but there's zero reason we can't improve on it. And stopping short at what our forefathers said a couple hundred years ago as the farthest we can take it is doing a disservice to our society. They did not have the end all answers to everything past and present.

I understand the concept, the relation to the constitution and where the burden of proof should lie. My point is we can preserve all of that and still address the issues. Not really concerned with who I sound like, a 70's law and order republican is fine with me so no offense taken off of that.

The connection with current events is there in its simplest form, it's not meant to be that complex.
 

kidfury

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The Georgia gun nuts will assert self defense and will be acquitted. All the gun nuts can’t acknowledge that our country’s obsession with guns killed this man. The chief gun nut here thinks the black guy should have been armed himself, so he could defend himself. One dead guy ain’t enough for him.
 

mundus

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The Georgia gun nuts will assert self defense and will be acquitted. All the gun nuts can’t acknowledge that our country’s obsession with guns killed this man. The chief gun nut here thinks the black guy should have been armed himself, so he could defend himself. One dead guy ain’t enough for him.
And only the guy with gun is allowed to "stand his ground".
 

hal9000

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The Georgia gun nuts will assert self defense and will be acquitted. All the gun nuts can’t acknowledge that our country’s obsession with guns killed this man. The chief gun nut here thinks the black guy should have been armed himself, so he could defend himself. One dead guy ain’t enough for him.
in that case, don’t be surprised or upset when people burn that state to the ground.
 

Ifallalot

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The Georgia gun nuts will assert self defense and will be acquitted. All the gun nuts can’t acknowledge that our country’s obsession with guns killed this man. The chief gun nut here thinks the black guy should have been armed himself, so he could defend himself. One dead guy ain’t enough for him.
This has nothing to do with guns and everything to do with 500 years of southern racism
 

mundus

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Its not complicated

This is similar to the guy patrolling the handicap parking spots armed

Neither should have confronted - hassled thier victums escalating the situation .

Call the police
The connected ex cop and his son thought they were the law, and would of gotten away with it if not for video.
 

GDaddy

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Longer (timelapse) video from across the street. He was apparently inside the house for several minutes, not just the first 5 seconds of the video which were shown in that TV news piece.

In addition to the construction materials shown in the inside video in GGs post above there's a piece of equipment (possibly a generator?) in the lower left hand of the screen, so I can see why the property owner might have been concerned enough about suffering a serious loss to install cameras.

<iframe width="560" height="315" src="
" frameborder="0" allow="accelerometer; autoplay; encrypted-media; gyroscope; picture-in-picture" allowfullscreen></iframe>


I saw some other commentary that the property owner of the house he entered has 4 security videos but he wasn't releasing them.
 
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