Ever feel like a groveler is too small for 3'-5' surf?

[Waterlogged05]

What board (model) is it?

Some higher volume boards can inhibit wave catching on some waves when it gets bigger. Sometimes being more on top of the water can hinder your entry.

At that dumpy spot the other day, even though it was small I wanted my shortboard
I was getting caught on the lip on that last couple of seconds where it pitches.
And the RNF is pretty high performance but it's slightly too wide and pitched me a few times I woulda made it normally

 

[92122]

What board (model) is it?

Some higher volume boards can inhibit wave catching on some waves when it gets bigger. Sometimes being more on top of the water can hinder your entry.

Puddle Jumper HP Lost x Lib Tech.

Lost Puddle Jumper HP FC - Futures™ Compatible

SPEED, UNLIMITED MOBILITY & PROGRESSION IN SMALL WAVES

www.lib-tech.com

I sink the thing pretty good, it just seems short getting sucked up a taller / faster moving face, and I don't feel like I ever get in early. I'll blame it on me being a sack of sh*t surfer right now and need to keep paddling multiple times a week and get in surfing shape, but sometimes on smaller waves on the same board I'll get thrown right into the wave.

 

[santacruzin]

This ^^^^^^ When you are grovelling your angle of attack on takeoff is relatively flat. You're basically taking off with the nose of the board going towards the beach. As it gets bigger your angle becomes more and more down hill. Volume and width in the front half of the board can become a hinderance as things get steeper. The shape of the rails and any concaves in the front half of the board also have a big effect as well.

if you wanna ride a groveler like in bigger surf . Gotta go super short then jam the thing under you paddle like hell and take off under the lip. Works every time


until it doesn’t

 

[Duffy LaCoronilla]

Puddle Jumper HP Lost x Lib Tech.

Lost Puddle Jumper HP FC - Futures™ Compatible

SPEED, UNLIMITED MOBILITY & PROGRESSION IN SMALL WAVES

www.lib-tech.com

I sink the thing pretty good, it just seems short getting sucked up a taller / faster moving face, and I don't feel like I ever get in early. I'll blame it on me being a sack of sh*t surfer right now and need to keep paddling multiple times a week and get in surfing shape, but sometimes on smaller waves on the same board I'll get thrown right into the wave.

Some higher volume boards can inhibit wave catching on some waves when it gets bigger. Sometimes being more on top of the water can hinder your entry.

And no, you don’t sink that thing pretty good.

 

[sdsrfr]

Spring is wind swell.

Wind swell has less push.

Less push means all of the sudden the wave breaks when it hits the shallow bar as opposed to slowly standing up and then tipping over.

you need to get on a plane faster. IMO, it’s egg season in socal.

 

[Chile Verde]

Puddle Jumper HP Lost x Lib Tech.

Lost Puddle Jumper HP FC - Futures™ Compatible

SPEED, UNLIMITED MOBILITY & PROGRESSION IN SMALL WAVES

www.lib-tech.com

I sink the thing pretty good, it just seems short getting sucked up a taller / faster moving face, and I don't feel like I ever get in early. I'll blame it on me being a sack of sh*t surfer right now and need to keep paddling multiple times a week and get in surfing shape, but sometimes on smaller waves on the same board I'll get thrown right into the wave.

I have the same board and yes once enough water is moving it starts to feel a little chattery/skittish. The overall width and wide tail are partially to blame but I think the LibTech construction also has something to do with it too. I am looking to replace it with a C-4 version or possibly a No Brainer which is overall a bit narrower and has a swallow tail. I figure the No Brainer would be nice for those in-between days or when a wave with a bit of bowl does pop up. Like Aruka said; “knowing when to grab which board is a skill unto itself”

 

[Duffy LaCoronilla]

if you wanna ride a groveler like in bigger surf . Gotta go super short then jam the thing under you paddle like hell and take off under the lip. Works every time


until it doesn’t

I like the bobber trick. Nose pointed up, sink the board tail first and when bobs back up, if timed right, you should be at mid face being launched forward. Sometimes you can achieve the rare no-paddle take off.

Works well with low volume boards in good surf.

 

[Autoprax]

I was surfing my Hynson twinzer a lot in junk surf.

I loved it.

Then I would be lazy and the surf would get better and I wouldn't change equipment.

I hated surfing steep back side waves on it.

 

[rowjimmytour]

if you wanna ride a groveler like in bigger surf . Gotta go super short then jam the thing under you paddle like hell and take off under the lip. Works every time


until it doesn’t

My gbuzz works great at this and so does her buzz cousins.

 

[PeterDj]

It depends on how you define groveler too. I think of grovelling days as small wind swell with fat/triangle shape and probably choppy surface. In that case you want low rocker. I'm 190lbs 6'1 and my groveller is 5'8 38L.

I like the bobber trick. Nose pointed up, sink the board tail first and when bobs back up, if timed right, you should be at mid face being launched forward. Sometimes you can achieve the rare no-paddle take off.

Works well with low volume boards in good surf.

I call this corking into the wave. The problem is you have groms sitting further out the back who pick up the wave before you can cork into it. Basically, when waves are triangle/fat you want low rocker. If it jacks up and gets boxy then you want high rocker. Volume only helps with paddling. If it's a short paddle out the back and boxy wave shape, try to go as low volume as you can get away with. If it is a mushy point break, then lower rocker and high volume. I've got a 5'8 38L board for those fat/triangle shape of waves. Sometimes, I'll run it in closeout shore break barrels, but nose will catch on occasion.

 

[bluengreen]

If you're a tall guy trying to surf a wide-nosed, voluminous board in small dumpy windswell, good luck to you, brother!

 

[SeaFoamGreen]

Id consider the PJHP more of a daily driver than groveler for someone in their 40s in average shape, that being me, but everyone's different. For a dedicated groveler I'd go standard PJ. Had the LIB version several years ago and loved it. Their hard to find now though, crap any OG PJ's are right now. But for 3' to 5' beachie that's not overly slopey and mushy, I'd say that's a good board? 36cL in LIB's is more like 37 or 38 in poly. I've found their pretty buoyant. Over foamed a LIB Short Round and hated it. Couldn't tell if it was the design or to much buoyancy, think it could have been both, but it kept getting hung up in the lip and couldn't push it down the wave face on drops. If your keen on LIBs check out the KA Swordfish. You'd gain a few more inches in length for the same volume, which I find length helps match speed for speed.

 

[000]

lots of wind swell lately, harder to be in the right spot
had a ton of waves i missed, others that broke on my back
perhaps its just the short period swell thats been screwing with your wave catching

 

[oeste858]

I sink the thing pretty good, it just seems short getting sucked up a taller / faster moving face, and I don't feel like I ever get in early. I'll blame it on me being a sack of sh*t surfer right now and need to keep paddling multiple times a week and get in surfing shape, but sometimes on smaller waves on the same board I'll get thrown right into the wave.

If you're never gettin into waves early on your groveler, it's not the right groveler for your waves.
And as others have said, spring windswell is weaker than winter swells we've gotten used to. So without that extra push, I think all of us are missing some waves

 

[sdsrfr]

for san diego, spring time grovelers are a special sort.

I kinda stop surfibg between March and June. It’s usually that bad aside from the early season south swells.

 

[SeaFoamGreen]

For sure on the wind swell thang. So noticeable when it all of the sudden switches this time of year. Always a bit of a bummer. We've had a lot of that too. Weak, thin lipped, and crumbly at times. Had a decent ground swell pulse on Sunday that felt oh so nice, but it was back to leftovers and wind smell. Went from a Ghost to a Fling in a matter of 12 hours and was even struggling on the Fling. To add insult to injury waters 47. Get me to Mainland Mex asap!

 

[Sharkbiscuit]

I have the same board and yes once enough water is moving it starts to feel a little chattery/skittish. The overall width and wide tail are partially to blame but I think the LibTech construction also has something to do with it too. I am looking to replace it with a C-4 version

IMHO the C4 will be even more chattery than the lib tech, especially if you have the one with the black carbon strip; those I think are all heavier than the non-stripped ones. The C4 is noticeably lighter than the libs, especially the black stripped ones. And I don't know why they feel heavier ("stringer" vs non stringer) that's just the only obvious thing I can point to.

I had a bad session in small but extremely dumpy Spanish House a couple years ago on my lib tech pj and drove up the road a ways to mushburger central and the board went right back to normal.

Sometimes the jacking ones don't want to let wide noses in/down. Sometimes the water movement, it feels like you're bobbing on a raft but with more rail line the board feels so much more alive paddling in.

If the same board goes fine in smaller waves it's the tide/sandbar/swell. Chip in vs no love.

 

[92122]

I like the bobber trick. Nose pointed up, sink the board tail first and when bobs back up, if timed right, you should be at mid face being launched forward. Sometimes you can achieve the rare no-paddle take off.

Works well with low volume boards in good surf.

Works especially well on Bodyboards. Need to get the technique going on the stand up stick.

 

[92122]

I have the same board and yes once enough water is moving it starts to feel a little chattery/skittish. The overall width and wide tail are partially to blame but I think the LibTech construction also has something to do with it too. I am looking to replace it with a C-4 version or possibly a No Brainer which is overall a bit narrower and has a swallow tail. I figure the No Brainer would be nice for those in-between days or when a wave with a bit of bowl does pop up. Like Aruka said; “knowing when to grab which board is a skill unto itself”

Interesting feedback, thank you.

I cant say I'd be interested in the C4 / EPS unless it was glassy. In general Lib Tech Construction feels pretty damp which I like.

 

[Chile Verde]

IMHO the C4 will be even more chattery than the lib tech, especially if you have the one with the black carbon strip; those I think are all heavier than the non-stripped ones. The C4 is noticeably lighter than the libs, especially the black stripped ones. And I don't know why they feel heavier ("stringer" vs non stringer) that's just the only obvious thing I can point to.

I had a bad session in small but extremely dumpy Spanish House a couple years ago on my lib tech pj and drove up the road a ways to mushburger central and the board went right back to normal.

Sometimes the jacking ones don't want to let wide noses in/down. Sometimes the water movement, it feels like you're bobbing on a raft but with more rail line the board feels so much more alive paddling in.

If the same board goes fine in smaller waves it's the tide/sandbar/swell. Chip in vs no love.

Interesting, thanks for the feedback. I was under the impression that the cork layer in the C4 construction provided a dampeninig effect but have never ridden one myself. The Lib on dumpy vs mushy comparison is spot on, Ive had similar experiences.