Did a section of trump's border wall blow down or not?

hal9000

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Immigration laws are arbitrary. Arbitrary laws suck.
lots of them are also misdemeanor offenses. We’re spending an awful lot of taxpayer money on misdemeanors. Meanwhile we could have had a guest worker program by now and, like Sharkbiscuit said earlier, have people paying into a system from which they’ll never benefit but we (U.S. citizens) will.
 

GDaddy

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And increase our quotas for legal immigration. Subject to the demand for more workers.

I think a guest worker program could be a good thing for everyone. Then the workers could come and go without a hassle, which would facilitate them leaving their families at home. Work for 6 or 9 months and then hang out at home for the rest of the year. SSN-free, if we wanted to set them up that way.

Establish a track record over a few years, don't get into trouble and and then they can be permitted to jump to the front of the line for a green card and citizenship if they can meet the other requirements.
 

ElOgro

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Maybe consensually fathering a child should be grounds for work permit or some such. An anchor nutting if you will. As the law stands he should be deported. I agree whatever his SSN play was, was illegit.

I'm just saying, this is about a .2 on the 1-10 scale - the wall, the wall falling over, a visa overstay working an honest job to support a kid he shot out his dick - I sure as hell don't blame him for trying given that obligation.

I surfed without a leash for about two months before today. Let me know when to report for the hanging.
I recognize that GDaddy’s example was a single individual.


Check page 18, if his buddy was deported in the three years covered in the graphic he wasn’t alone.

Check out the rest for fun.

El Chapo proved that a wall isn’t gonna stop someone that knows how to dig a tunnel. I’ve never advocated building a wall for that reason. “No hay muro qué detenga una buena mexicanada.” Una mexicanada means a Mexican work around to avoid doing something that will save time and effort by coming up with a solution to a problem regardless of being correct. Or functional for more than one minute after you’ve paid for a service and the payee has beat feet. It’s important to remember that the cost per head of 3k usd plus goes into the coffers of Mexican organized crime. In your travels here I’m sure you’ve encountered a few mexicanadas at some level.

I’ve always been an advocate of a temporary work permit program, if for no other reason than to mitigate cash flow to organized crime for services rendered. Or not.
 
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hal9000

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And increase our quotas for legal immigration. If and when we need more workers.

I think a guest worker program could be a good thing for everyone. Then the workers could come and go without a hassle, which would facilitate them leaving their families at home. Work for 6 or 9 months and then hang out at home for the rest of the year. SSN-free, if we wanted to set them up that way.

Establish a track record over a few years, don't get into trouble and and then they can be permitted to jump to the front of the line for a green card and citizenship if they can meet the other requirements.
this sounds like a sane and common-sense approach.:shaka:
 

GDaddy

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It can only work if we get some level of control over the numbers coming in. And who is allowed to work here. IMO.

The people who jump through all the hoops it takes to come in through the front door deserve to get ahead.
 

test_article

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It can only work if we get some level of control over the numbers coming in. And who is allowed to work here. IMO.

The people who jump through all the hoops it takes to come in through the front door deserve to get ahead.
In that case, the U.S. has to stop propping up ineffective gov'ts. in Latin America and incentivize them to take better care of their gang problem. In other words, stop the caravans.

Immigration decisions are not arbitrary. They have, until the recent Dem/Rep impasse, always been based on int'l. politics and solving labor shortages. Now, it's more about putting out brush fires and costing billions more in enforcement annually.
 
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hal9000

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It can only work if we get some level of control over the numbers coming in. And who is allowed to work here. IMO.

The people who jump through all the hoops it takes to come in through the front door deserve to get ahead.

Legal ports of entry are where most people get in and overstay.

The border wall is a shiny object for the morons to rally behind.
 
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GDaddy

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In that case, the U.S. has to stop propping up ineffective gov'ts. in Latin America and incentivize them to take better care of their gang problem. In other words, stop the caravans.

Immigration decisions are not arbitrary. They have, until the recent Dem/Rep impasse, always been based on int'l. politics and solving labor shortages. Now, it's more about putting out brush fires and costing billions more in enforcement annually.
I don't see it as an either-or choice to make. I see it as both.

And "propping up ineffective govts" is a BS argument. Almost all of the migrants come for economic reasons.
 

test_article

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I don't see it as an either-or choice to make. I see it as both.

And "propping up ineffective govts" is a BS argument. Almost all of the migrants come for economic reasons.
...either what or what?

Of course, the enabling of gangs is based on the economy. It's still the fault of gov't.
 

GDaddy

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It's not either go after the overstays or slow down the illegal entry. It's both.

And you're right, gang violence is the responsibility of the govt. The local govt.
 
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test_article

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And you're right, gang violence is the responsibility of the govt. The local govt.
I'm not sure that holds even in the U.S. anymore with RICO and Homeland Security deployments, much less Latin America. Does Donnie BooBoo no longer have an erection for MS13?

Mexico uses its military against gangs, automatic weapons on street corners.
 
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ElOgro

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Legal ports of entry are where most people get in and overstay.

The border wall is a shiny object for the morons to rally behind.
So, are you saying that most of the over 200,000 deportees per annum from 2017 - 2019 entered the USA through a legal port of entry? That’s stupid even for you.
 

hal9000

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It's not either go after the overstays or slow down the illegal entry. It's both.

And you're right, gang violence is the responsibility of the govt. The local govt.
Legalize marijuana. Right there you take away a big chunk of gang business and cartel business. I'm not sure what % it would work out to, since there aren't reliable numbers out there.

Decriminalize other drugs while we're at it.

If prohibition taught us one thing, it's that making vices illegal does not work and it encourages gang activity.
 

manbearpig

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If I speed or I walk outside to take my trash cans out to the curb without wearing a mask I do so knowing that I'm in the wrong and that if I get caught I get what I get. I don't do it with the idea that the govt has no right to punish me for my misdeeds because violating the rules is a human right.

And as I say, if the govt *chooses* to make an exception for me out of compassion or because they think I'm oh-so-special that is strictly discretionary on their part. It's not something the govt automatically owes to me just because I was having a bad day.
[/QUOTE
It's not either go after the overstays or slow down the illegal entry. It's both.

And you're right, gang violence is the responsibility of the govt. The local govt.
It’s almost as if trump does the complete opposite of what you believe.

yet you step right in line.
 

GDaddy

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LOL

AFAICT Portland and Seattle were allowing the street violence to continue with their hands-off approach. Now they're not. Moreover, their change of heart didn't occur by choice. They are stepping forward against their will.
 

ElOgro

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Legalize marijuana. Right there you take away a big chunk of gang business and cartel business. I'm not sure what % it would work out to, since there aren't reliable numbers out there.

Decriminalize other drugs while we're at it.

If prohibition taught us one thing, it's that making vices illegal does not work and it encourages gang activity.
Not a big chunk of Cartel business at this point.

Which other drugs do you advocate decriminalizing? How would that work? Please be specific.
 
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GDaddy

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Weed is legal in California and prior to being legalized it had been trivialized in the criminal justice system for years.

The gangs switched over to do different crimes. They weren't criminals because weed was illegal, they were dealing with weed because they're criminals.
 
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test_article

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Weed is legal in California and prior to being legalized it had been trivialized in the criminal justice system for years.

The gangs switched over to do different crimes. They weren't criminals because weed was illegal, they were dealing with weed because they're criminals.
Plata o plomo...seems like a good reason to forego officialdom. What would you have done, erstwhile cop?