Asymmetrical Twin

ChaseTMP

Billy Hamilton status
Apr 6, 2014
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This is a board from Josh Keogh I thought was interesting. I've been considering an asymmetrical twin (or possibly quads on my heel side) and wondered if channels on my heel side would help with bite off the bottom? I swapped boards for about an hour a few weeks ago at B+ El Porto and got to try an Album Disasym, which was pretty fun frontside, but I really had to baby it off the bottom backside. The board had Album's Futures which were designed with True Ames and Matt Parker/Album.

I've only shaped two boards (probably 24 years ago) and only have ridden one channel bottom (brought it to the Mentawais and hated it, could have just something other than the channels). A question to those with more design experience than me, would adding channels to one side help with a more positive feeling off the bottom backside? Would it just be better to have six symmetrical?

I'd like to get the board through XTR and Album seems to be the only one that routinely does asyms. I reached out to Timmy Patterson (twice), but no response. Guess he's too busy with orders after Italo's title.
 

Aruka

Tom Curren status
Feb 23, 2010
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I have a asym Album Townsend twin which I really like. I got it as my cheater board and just to try something different. It's a 6-8 but it turns quite sharp off the top on my frontside. Backside it's actually not terrible but it definitely feels a bit longer and not as positive which is why I'm thinking of getting something similar but just going with a symmetrical round tail. Not really feeling the channels, just haven't had great experiences with them yet.
 
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jkb

Tom Curren status
Feb 22, 2005
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If you're comparing an asym twin with channels vs an asym board that has a quad set-up on the heelside and no channels, I'm guessing the quad set-up on the heelside would provide more stability. Perhaps a larger quad template on the heelside of that album would have worked better for you.

But you could still get a twin to work backside without channels if you wanted. Just move the fins back. I'm pretty sure I heard that on here somewhere but can't remember where. :geek:
 

ChaseTMP

Billy Hamilton status
Apr 6, 2014
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I'd most likely be riding quads on the heel side as opposed to a twin, but the question was more about if there'd be a benefit of channels on only the heel side? The lead fin on the Album I rode looked in the medium range and the rear was really small (looked smaller than a grom fin), so I definitely could have used more fin, since I generally ride large fins (5'11 and 175 lbs). The guy I swapped boards with (he was asking about my Varial CI Neck Beard 2) was almost the same height and weight, but didn't surf too well, so I'm pretty sure I was pushing a lot harder through turns than he was.

That's the thing with asyms and potential demos; you're hard-pressed to find one in your stance and size to try out and the two main people in Southern California making them are pretty spendy (Ryan Burch and Matt Parker/Album).
 

oeste858

Phil Edwards status
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I have a asym Album Townsend twin which I really like.. Backside it's actually not terrible but it definitely feels a bit longer and not as positive which is why I'm thinking of getting something similar but just going with a symmetrical round tail.
That's disappointing to hear. I thought the whole point of the asym was that you would NOT have to baby bside turns.

As for the channels, I agree with you thinking that just be why Keough put them on that side. But if I'm gonna try the asym thing, I'd want to go with quad on my heels.
 
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jkb

Tom Curren status
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I'm sure the channels on that twin give it a little more stability backside, but I don't think you'd need the channels if he set the fins further back. They look pretty far forward when comparing them to my asym.
 

jkb

Tom Curren status
Feb 22, 2005
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Both are Burch's.

No, both are set-up as quad on the heel side, but it looks like Ryan places his toe-side twins in the same spot whether the board is exclusively a twin or twin/quad. At least, that's what it looks like to me.......could be mistaken.
 
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Toobz

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Oct 8, 2013
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I’m in the process of ordering an Asym at the moment. I’ve always thought the design principle had validity especially for me as I unfortunately had to get an ankle fusion a few years back.
I’ve been looking at fins and agree that the Album fin set looks a little small for my liking. I did see he also offers a fin set designed for his Fascination model which peaked my interest. It looks like a “Controller” type split keel on the heel side.
Personally I think I’ll just start with a set of flat foiled rear quads to run with my Jordy’s L or EA Blackstix on the heel side and see. I also have Controllers to try too. There are other options out there to like the True Ames Lovelace Asym set and a few Asym shapers seem to recommend the T1 twin and EA Quad combo.
 

twinzerfan

Michael Peterson status
Oct 26, 2006
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I ran normal quads on my asymmetrical boards. Tried sll kinds, and found they we’re better than special sets

here’s one with a side cut on the heel side that i loved, and regret selling it. Despite all the negative talk and gimmicky reputation of side cuts, it was tons of fun.

75BFDA4E-29A2-475E-9EE7-30C14240A736.jpeg
 
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Oceanslide

Kelly Slater status
Mar 5, 2008
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I made a few asymmetrical boards for myself and customers. Most people wanted wuads heel side. I made a twinzer for myself and really enjoyed it.



I personally find channels project down the line more than providing any “bite” per se
Damn, that looks like a good time. You still shaping, and where are you located currently?
 
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twinzerfan

Michael Peterson status
Oct 26, 2006
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Damn, that looks like a good time. You still shaping, and where are you located currently?
hey man, thanks for that!

not making boards anymore, although I threaten to once in a while... I moved to Florida a while back. I do miss Santa Cruz and San Diego more than i should admit, lol

Those boards from Keogh look fun. Clean shapes
 

Aruka

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Feb 23, 2010
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That's disappointing to hear. I thought the whole point of the asym was that you would NOT have to baby bside turns.

As for the channels, I agree with you thinking that just be why Keough put them on that side. But if I'm gonna try the asym thing, I'd want to go with quad on my heels.
To clarify, the board doesn't feel like it can't be pushed backside. It holds through the bottom turn but then feels long coming around off the top. Which makes sense just looking at the outline. I don't really see how an asym with a shortened heal side outline is going to feel equally as good back side and front side. Maybe a symmetrical outline with asym twin placement would be a good compromise. You'd still get that off-set fin placement to accommodate the heal-to-toe splay but you wouldn't have that much shorter rail line on the heal side. Maybe I just haven't given it enough thought, I'm kind of late to this weird game.
 

twinzerfan

Michael Peterson status
Oct 26, 2006
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Aruka makes a good point about different rail lengths. I’m sure it works for some people, but I preferred a rounded or curvy outline on heel side instead of shorter. It seemed to transition better, and more naturally.

take your favorite boards for either direction and combine them?
 

oeste858

Phil Edwards status
Sep 11, 2017
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the Lost "Maysm" has a pretty subtle tail. Might be a good starting point for dipping a toe in the asym waters.
I've almost pulled the trigger on a Lovelace Soopersnake many times on the Varial stock page, but I don't have confidence I would size it correctly.
I'm surprised not to see them from more top shapers. I wonder if a lot of guys just dismiss the idea out of hand as a gimmick. Personally, I'd love to see fairly creative guys like Tomo, Christenson, Pyzel play around with it and see what they come up with. Maybe they are, but choose to keep the R&D footage top secret?
 

jkb

Tom Curren status
Feb 22, 2005
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I ran normal quads on my asymmetrical boards. Tried sll kinds, and found they we’re better than special sets

here’s one with a side cut on the heel side that i loved, and regret selling it. Despite all the negative talk and gimmicky reputation of side cuts, it was tons of fun.

View attachment 85382
Wait, an asym with a sidecut??

rts265 is going to loose his sh!t!!

Doesn't a sidecut give you a tighter turning arc and wouldn't a shorter rail line on the heel side essentially do the same thing?

Board looks awesome, BTW. :shaka:
 
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twinzerfan

Michael Peterson status
Oct 26, 2006
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Wait, an asym with a sidecut??

rts265 is going to loose his sh!t!!

Doesn't a sidecut give you a tighter turning arc and wouldn't a shorter rail line on the heel side essentially do the same thing?
I can only talk from my personal experience, and never claimed to be all knowing. Especially when it comes to actual customer feedback.
I really like the side cut design. It definitely does tighten up the turning radius, but without the sometimes choppy feeling of a short rail. It’s kind of like a round tail, but the straight section is still driving. If that makes any sense...

the boards I made also had different rockers on each sidr, so there’s a lot going on, and I feel that is very important too. Not just outlines

again just my 2c

edir : forgot to add that I totally agree with starting simple before going extreme. Especially when spending money on a crazy design. Hypocrisy I know, as i made some seemingly wild stuff, but even so
 
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