10 Myths About Lower Back Pain (LBP)

PRCD

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Aha! So, if I believe my injury was a result of repeatedly being in the hunched over position (my original back problems started after a 3 day tube fest of 3 hour sessions), should I also train with some degree of flexion?
Here's how chronic back pain usually begins. You overdo it one day working in the yard or doing something else (glute muscles are often the culprit in LBP, btw). Instead of just backing-off, resting up a little, and realizing you'll be fully healed in a week or two, you worry and go to the doctor. The doctor performs MRIs and tells you the pain is likely due to your spine. The doctor sees something on your MRI which is common for most people as they age and usually not a problem and tells you that it's the cause of your pain. It was probably there long before you had any back pain. You worry more. The doctor's post hoc reasoning about your pain causes you to believe you have a damaged spine and you're stuck this way. Your pain now worsens and becomes chronic because you are afraid of moving. The doctor refers you to an orthopedist or a spine surgeon, etc.

My friend is a spine surgeon and says there's nothing to operate on in most of the chronic pain patients he sees. He refers them back to pain care. At most pain care clinics they give you antidepressants and muscle relaxants which make the problem worse.

If you want to get better, educate yourself about pain and ease back into the activities you were doing before. Otherwise, you won't get better. .
 
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PRCD

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There's nothing dangerous about sitting or using any of the available positions of the spine.
That's the other thing. There's all this pseudoscientific talk about "correct" biomechanics and posture in the rehab community, but for example there are two completely different definitions of what "correct" sitting looks like. The reality is you can't stay in any position too long without needing to move to another one and you need to be able to get into different positions. Your body and nervous system will adapt to the demands put on it.
 
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One-Off

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Here's how chronic back pain usually begins. You overdo it one day working in the yard or doing something else (glute muscles are often the culprit in LBP, btw). Instead of just backing-off, resting up a little, and realizing you'll be fully healed in a week or two, you worry and go to the doctor. The doctor performs MRIs and tells you the pain is likely due to your spine. The doctor sees something on your MRI which is common for most people as they age and usually not a problem and tells you that it's the cause of your pain. It was probably there long before you had any back pain. You worry more. The doctor's post hoc reasoning about your pain causes you to believe you have a damaged spine and you're stuck this way. Your pain now worsens and becomes chronic because you are afraid of moving. The doctor refers you to an orthopedist or a spine surgeon, etc.

My friend is a spine surgeon and says there's nothing to operate on in most of the chronic pain patients he sees. He refers them back to pain care. At most pain care clinics they give you antidepressants and muscle relaxants which make the problem worse.

If you want to get better, educate yourself about pain and ease back into the activities you were doing before. Otherwise, you won't get better. .
Actually I have to hand it to my MDs. After the ER visit my primary care MD sent me to pain specialist. The pain guy right away said, in so many words- "It's good they did no imaging at the ER and we do not plan on doing any imaging. Number one priority is is PT. Get moving." I asked about weight lifting and both MD, pain guy and PT were, yeah that's good. All with the caveat to take it slow and incrementally. The pain guy did offer acupuncture which I declined and gave me a TENS machine which I used once (any one want to buy a used TENS machine? Like new, used only once). My plan was always PT- stretches, body weight exercises and then on to weights.

I'm getting there slowly. Had a good surf this AM. Not the dumping overhead barrels of last week so I felt more competent (last week I was hesitant, coming off two months on the bench, and the airdrops were sketchy and I blew my fair share:drowning:). Today I was at a "longboard" spot and my pop ups were fine, back feels fine. Maybe the deadlifts are working. I know Havoc give me shiite for my toddler weights but I'm doing what the MDs and PTs said- incrementally. I'm ready for my my next step but the plates are either out of stock or the ones in stock cost twice as much as the out of stock ones. I called my little sister, who I discovered months ago, to my surprise, had the whole set up- cage, bench and weights, to see if she could loan me 35 or 45 lb plates. And she was like, "..mmmmm Emma (my 17 year old niece) is working with a trainer right now and kind of needs them." So what Havoc says about the girly weights is true. My little niece is putting 35 and 45 lb plates on the bar and putting me to shame.:trout:

Just recently listened to this. They have something to say about flexion. Mostly that it's not that bad.

 
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PRCD

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Actually I have to hand it to my MDs. After the ER visit my primary care MD sent me to pain specialist. The pain guy right away said, in so many words- "It's good they did no imaging at the ER and we do not plan on doing any imaging. Number one priority is is PT. Get moving." I asked about weight lifting and both MD, pain guy and PT were, yeah that's good. All with the caveat to take it slow and incrementally. The pain guy did offer acupuncture which I declined and gave me a TENS machine which I used once (any one want to buy a used TENS machine? Like new, used only once). My plan was always PT- stretches, body weight exercises and then on to weights.

I'm getting there slowly. Had a good surf this AM. Not the dumping overhead barrels of last week so I felt more competent (last week I was hesitant, coming off two months on the bench, and the airdrops were sketchy and I blew my fair share:drowning:). Today I was at a "longboard" spot and my pop ups were fine, back feels fine. Maybe the deadlifts are working. I know Havoc give me shiite for my toddler weights but I'm doing what the MDs and PTs said- incrementally. I'm ready for my my next step but the plates are either out of stock or the ones in stock cost twice as much as the out of stock ones. I called my little sister, who I discovered months ago, to my surprise, had the whole set up- cage, bench and weights, to see if she could loan me 35 or 45 lb plates. And she was like, "..mmmmm Emma (my 17 year old niece) is working with a trainer right now and kind of needs them." So what Havoc says about the girly weights is true. My little niece is putting 35 and 45 lb plates on the bar and putting me to shame.

Just recently listened to this. They have something to say about flexion. Mostly that it's not that bad.

Greg Lehman knows what he's talking about.

The "incremental approach" is actually to convince your nervous system that everything is OK, even when your muscular and skeletal system can handle the load. The nervous system has an "alarm system" component which is what triggers your mind to produce pain even when there is no danger.

My advice to everyone is to stop worrying about what everyone else is lifting and work on your own progress. When I started with a chronic pain condition, I was lifting pink weights. I progressed to a point most people can't reach by incremental progress and patience. Genetically, I do not have gifts for any of the big lifts because I have long legs and a short torso and not very long arms. My torso is almost parallel to the floor when I start a deadlift.

This is not a competition with other people. It's a competition against yourself and gravity.
 

tacos

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Feb 12, 2006
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i thin a 300lb squat is a good goal for middle aged duus at 170 lbs
definitely good goal, but that’s a somewhat lofty goal for someone who either doesn’t lift or just started lifting. which brings me back to my easy goals: sure there are plenty of people who can squat body weight and DL 1.5x bodyweight, the difference is people who regularly do. Either of these can be easily reached and maintained, and I think just actually doing it is an important thing for someone with LBP who doesn’t lift.
 
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Havoc

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definitely good goal, but that’s a somewhat lofty goal for someone who either doesn’t lift or just started lifting. which brings me back to my easy goals: sure there are plenty of people who can squat body weight and DL 1.5x bodyweight, the difference is people who regularly do. Either of these can be easily reached and maintained, and I think just actually doing it is an important thing for someone with LBP who doesn’t lift.
linear progression can get u close to 275lb squat and 300 lb dl in 1 year or less even if completely untrained.
 

PRCD

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definitely good goal, but that’s a somewhat lofty goal for someone who either doesn’t lift or just started lifting. which brings me back to my easy goals: sure there are plenty of people who can squat body weight and DL 1.5x bodyweight, the difference is people who regularly do. Either of these can be easily reached and maintained, and I think just actually doing it is an important thing for someone with LBP who doesn’t lift.
There's a huge variance in all this based on age, genetics, stress level, health. The best thing to do is just do you and see where you get. You'll know when you get towards the end of an LP because your reps become slow and a grind. That said, you have to learn to grind somewhat. @VonMeister probably has several good intermediate programs he can tailor for you.
 
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One-Off

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definitely good goal, but that’s a somewhat lofty goal for someone who either doesn’t lift or just started lifting. which brings me back to my easy goals: sure there are plenty of people who can squat body weight and DL 1.5x bodyweight, the difference is people who regularly do. Either of these can be easily reached and maintained, and I think just actually doing it is an important thing for someone with LBP who doesn’t lift.
I like easy. I'm pretty sure it'll be enough protect my back for surfing, considering I surfed 40+ years without doing any strength training at all. Maybe the back injury last year was a good thing, giving me a wake up call as I hit my 60's. I'm not attracted to big numbers with weights the way I am with big numbers distance running....but that could change...

I just got 25 lb plates so I can up my numbers a bit...
 

feralseppo

Billy Hamilton status
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Here's how chronic back pain usually begins. You overdo it one day working in the yard or doing something else (glute muscles are often the culprit in LBP, btw). Instead of just backing-off, resting up a little, and realizing you'll be fully healed in a week or two, you worry and go to the doctor. The doctor performs MRIs and tells you the pain is likely due to your spine. The doctor sees something on your MRI which is common for most people as they age and usually not a problem and tells you that it's the cause of your pain. It was probably there long before you had any back pain. You worry more. The doctor's post hoc reasoning about your pain causes you to believe you have a damaged spine and you're stuck this way. Your pain now worsens and becomes chronic because you are afraid of moving. The doctor refers you to an orthopedist or a spine surgeon, etc.

My friend is a spine surgeon and says there's nothing to operate on in most of the chronic pain patients he sees. He refers them back to pain care. At most pain care clinics they give you antidepressants and muscle relaxants which make the problem worse.

If you want to get better, educate yourself about pain and ease back into the activities you were doing before. Otherwise, you won't get better. .
One orthopedist I saw says 99% of the people he sees are not surgery candidates. He called me a 1%'er.
I'm seeing one this week. See what he says about regaining the strength in my calf so it works properly. It can't lift my weight at the moment. I am pain free and can do anything that doens't require my calf to lift my body weight. It's been six weeks since this happened and I have no real change in my calf strength or the numbness in the same foot.

I'd just as soon wait it out as long as there was no risk of long term nerve damage and not regaining my calf strength. Numbness no big deal, nonfunctional calf, not so much.
 
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PRCD

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Actually I have to hand it to my MDs. After the ER visit my primary care MD sent me to pain specialist. The pain guy right away said, in so many words- "It's good they did no imaging at the ER and we do not plan on doing any imaging. Number one priority is is PT. Get moving." I asked about weight lifting and both MD, pain guy and PT were, yeah that's good. All with the caveat to take it slow and incrementally. T
Sounds like they're actually starting to learn and practice modern pain medicine. Psykophant/bobblehead would agree with this approach.

I'm getting there slowly. Had a good surf this AM. Not the dumping overhead barrels of last week so I felt more competent (last week I was hesitant, coming off two months on the bench, and the airdrops were sketchy and I blew my fair share:drowning:). Today I was at a "longboard" spot and my pop ups were fine, back feels fine.
sounds like your back is fine/works better than mine. I'm certainly not making any air drops.

Maybe the deadlifts are working. I know Havoc give me shiite for my toddler weights but I'm doing what the MDs and PTs said- incrementally. I'm ready for my my next step but the plates are either out of stock or the ones in stock cost twice as much as the out of stock ones. I called my little sister, who I discovered months ago, to my surprise, had the whole set up- cage, bench and weights, to see if she could loan me 35 or 45 lb plates. And she was like, "..mmmmm Emma (my 17 year old niece) is working with a trainer right now and kind of needs them." So what Havoc says about the girly weights is true. My little niece is putting 35 and 45 lb plates on the bar and putting me to shame.:trout:
I have some 35 lb bumper plates I never use if you want them. I'll give them to you or anyone else to get them out of my garage.
 
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Havoc

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I like easy. I'm pretty sure it'll be enough protect my back for surfing, considering I surfed 40+ years without doing any strength training at all. Maybe the back injury last year was a good thing, giving me a wake up call as I hit my 60's. I'm not attracted to big numbers with weights the way I am with big numbers distance running....but that could change...

I just got 25 lb plates so I can up my numbers a bit...
easy doesnt work
 

SurfFuerteventura

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This ought to make you lifters in here chuckle.

I deadlift 2 x 8 kilo kettlebell weights.

Yup, 16 kilos (just over 35 lbs)

Butt I out paddle people less than half my age, and out surf them too.



:roflmao::roflmao::roflmao::drowning::drowning::drowning::poke:
 

feralseppo

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Feb 28, 2006
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Looked at my recent MRI report. My current symptoms might be the result of a sequestered disc. Meaning a piece disc material broke off and is floating around “below the exiting root of L5-S1 on the left side.“ The leg with The symptoms. It measures at 12 x 9 x 9 mm. Also says it’s obliterating the left neural foramen completely.

Playing internet doctor, I read these broken off disc pieces usually reabsorb overtime. And surgery usually not so effective. Let’s hope so.

What do the deadlift doctors recommend? I wonder if there is any way to get this stuff to reabsorb sooner than later.

MRI report also showed that a prior disc bulge from about 4 years ago no longer existed. Others were smaller When comparing the prior reports.
 
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SurfFuerteventura

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I have noticed pee stains on my lifting tights now that you mention it, is that bad? Don't worry though, I wash them once a month when the yellow turns a bit brown.

Should I be starting with less? It does hurt a bit too much in my lower back to be honest.

Maybe I will cut down to one weight at a time?