Pyzel 'Shadow'

[MathDebater]

All the GX's I've owned have all been short like 6-0 to 6-2 and the Shiv is a 6-4. Still, there is some overlap as far as how they perform in similar sized waves. The GX probably grovels a little better with the lower rocker through the midsection but gives up some control in juicy surf. That could be partially due to the GX's being shorter so there's less rail line but I also think the Shiv has more "effective" rocker overall. It's more of a smooth curve without that lower staged section that the GX has through the middle. To me the Shiv feels like it has quite a bit of rocker but the wider forward outline and foam flow give it a bit of additional paddle and glide compared to other HPSB's. The thing I would definitely caution about the Shiv is the importance of getting the thickness right.

Got it, thanks. I was just curious because it sounds like you've been riding it in a lot of the same conditions I'd pull out my GX. You've definitely made me very shiv curious. I've had a few flat decked boards but never gotten the size quite right, but it's been enough to make me want to keep trying.

 

[Aruka]

good stuff daave. I don't mean to sound negative on the phantom at all. I just think it's a board that could throw you off if you base your expectations on how it looks. I rode mine a lot last year, especially in Baja where it worked great in the quality point waves up north and the punchy reef/beachies down south. up here in the PNW though I sometimes struggled on it. it felt like too much rocker for the weak waves in the bay but then if I'd take it to a powerful beachbreak I would be wishing for more length and control. I still had great sessions on it but it felt like it needed a fairly specific type of wave for me to really dig it. with the Shadow and the Ghosts I know not to take them out unless it's chest high+ so I haven't had many sessions where I felt like there wasn't enough push to wake the boards up.

mathdebater, yeah there is definitely some overlap between the two. they are quite different ways to skin a cat though. to give you some context I haven't been riding my GX much in the last year because I've gained about 15lbs. which has a bunch of old favorites feeling a little thin. I think my days of riding 2 3/8" thick shortboards might be over. but anyways, I also haven't ridden the Shiv in too much tiny surf to really test the low end but last night I took it out in some fairly soft but kind of fast waist high rights and it felt like I was pushing the lower limits of that board. I could get in and keep up with the wave but I really had to work to get out in front enough to fit in turns and then often times the wave would pass me up. for a 6-4 round tail I was not mad at how the board performed but I think the GX would have fared a bit better. it always impressed me with it's lower end. I ended up grabbing the Fling off the beach which had no problem making and holding speed in those conditions.

to keep it somewhat on topic, I don't think I would have ever even tried to surf the Shadow in those waves.

 

[trifish]

Haven't tried the shadow yet - but above breakdown sounds pretty spot on. I absolutely love my phantom as a DD. But I generally surf dumpy quick beachbreaks, which is pretty different from what I surfed when I lived on the west coast. So I like the condensed package. Looking to get a shadow for our good clean days and travel. Also have a ghost that I really like. To complicate things a little more, guys seem to really like the pyzalien, which seems to fit right in between the phantom/shadow in terms of dimensions/volume.

Just for reference, I'm just under 6'0 x 175. Ride a stock phantom (5'10" x 19.5" x 2.5"/30L). Slightly oversized custom ghost (6'0"x 19.63" x 2.6"). Also had a stock 5'8" gremlin (just sold - good board but too much overlap with others). Was thinking of trying a shadow or pyzalien around 5'11" x 19 1/4" x 2.5"/around 30 L. The longer HPSBs just don't seem to 'fit' as well in our waves. But at the same time, I'm never sure if messing with dims messes with the design too much.

Daave, the stock shadow was to long for my height/weight (5'9"/180lbs) so I got more of a shorter custom shadow where it is wider/thicker so I could get the liters I like (32.77L) on a 6' length. Just got back from another session on it this morning. Board is killing it. After just a few sessions on it i'm loving it. Just so balanced and doesn't throw surprises at me. I've had it in waves I shouldn't have and it catches them and surfs great. I talked to Pyzel about boards alot and they kept recommending it to me, so I gave it a whirl. Jon and those guys were on the money.

For me, I loved the Ghost so I figured I would love the Phantom but it didn't really grovel like I was hoping and I leaned alot on my ghost when the waves got better anyways. So I sold the Phantom and I ended up getting a Gremlin which handles the lower end much better and gives me a better range in my quiver. I feel like now the Shadow slots in nicely between my Gremlin and Ghost.

 

[waxfoot]

What dims did you end up with on the Shadow @trifish ?
I'm basically the same body dims as you at 5.10 x 182lbs, and was looking to get a Shadow round tail for a trip I'm doing next year.

I'm quite different than you in my feelings about the Phantom, as it's the best DD I've had in many years, absolutely love it, but want something that's going to hold a bit more + a little mroe length / narrower tail for my trip to Sumbawa. I was thinking of getting mine 6 x 19 3/8 and 2 9/16 (or 2 5/8). What did you do for the rail, just tell them to whittle it down to the 'standard 6 foot board's rail', if you went thicker ?

 

[shaheeb]

Its interesting as i have ridden a couple phantoms and own one now. BOth were stock 5'9's. The demo model last year had fuller rails as some have mentioned. The newer one i just picked up second hand is more foiled in the rails, outline looks the same etc... Boards looks and feels absolutely killer! but to me, this boar is a head scratcher fer sure. sometimes it flies and turns, sometimes you fall and its like wtf?

I'm blaming it on fins for now, 165lb middle aged fart wanabe shredr. tried the yellow Am larges for a start. They went good, plenty of drive, turns were pretty decent. This combo didnt feel great but wasnt bad. waves were solid 3-4 baks
same session i tried the new jjf green stripe- mediums. no drive, short arc turns, total bummer. 5 waves i was over it.
The super helpful dude at Pyzel (949#) said to try the medium Ams. blue honey combs or the Pyzel controls next.
Time will tell, just thrashed a knee...road to recovery blues.
Shadow sounds really good so far

 

[waxfoot]

I use the FCS2 AM2 Aircore fins in the phantom and works great. They're really stiff fins, so thought I'd give the FCS2 MB a go too - will report back once I've used them.

 

[trifish]

What dims did you end up with on the Shadow @trifish ?
I'm basically the same body dims as you at 5.10 x 182lbs, and was looking to get a Shadow round tail for a trip I'm doing next year.

I'm quite different than you in my feelings about the Phantom, as it's the best DD I've had in many years, absolutely love it, but want something that's going to hold a bit more + a little mroe length / narrower tail for my trip to Sumbawa. I was thinking of getting mine 6 x 19 3/8 and 2 9/16 (or 2 5/8). What did you do for the rail, just tell them to whittle it down to the 'standard 6 foot board's rail', if you went thicker ?

It took a good bit of width/thickness to get 32.77L in a 6' Shadow that normally sits at 29.40L since it is a hpsb. XTR told me these dims... 6' x 19.75 x 2 11/16 would get me to 32.77L. It was wider/thicker than what I was thinking at first but I like to keep my volume over 32.5L these days and rolled with it. It was where a 6'3" or 6'4" model fell at width/thickness wise I believe. So the width/thickness was being bumped similarly. I didn't give them any specifics on the rails but the rails turned out more foiled than my 6'3 ghost in comparison. Board doesn't look 19.75 or 2 11/16 to me, it feels smaller, so i think the volume was placed well.

 

[kool-aid]

It took a good bit of width/thickness to get 32.77L in a 6' Shadow that normally sits at 29.40L since it is a hpsb. XTR told me these dims... 6' x 19.75 x 2 11/16 would get me to 32.77L. It was wider/thicker than what I was thinking at first but I like to keep my volume over 32.5L these days and rolled with it. It was where a 6'3" or 6'4" model fell at width/thickness wise I believe. So the width/thickness was being bumped similarly. I didn't give them any specifics on the rails but the rails turned out more foiled than my 6'3 ghost in comparison. Board doesn't look 19.75 or 2 11/16 to me, it feels smaller, so i think the volume was placed well.

Wow, that thing is sick. Pretty hard to get 33L into a 6'0. I'd probably sacrifice the .2L and drop it down to 19.5. I'd also consider bumping it up to a 6'1.

Pyzel's don't seem to scale up all that well in volume. In my experience Losts do that pretty well though.

 

[trifish]

Wow, that thing is sick. Pretty hard to get 33L into a 6'0. I'd probably sacrifice the .2L and drop it down to 19.5. I'd also consider bumping it up to a 6'1.

Pyzel's don't seem to scale up all that well in volume. In my experience Losts do that pretty well though.

Yeh I debated the dims/vol a bit but cheeseburgers won out . So far thing has been a blast in the chest high stuff it has been in lately. Still waiting on some more swell to see how it does in the upper range but so far it has had the same magic I felt when I first got my ghost.

 

[kool-aid]

Yeh I debated the dims/vol a bit but cheeseburgers won out . So far thing has been a blast in the chest high stuff it has been in lately. Still waiting on some more swell to see how it does in the upper range but so far it has had the same magic I felt when I first got my ghost.

I'll be interested to hear what you have to say about that. For me the shadow didn't perform as well in the upper range for me as I had hoped. But kind of doesn't surprise me all that much given what it was created for. It's still one of my all-time favorite shortboards though in everyday waves. My upper range, however, is legitimate step up surf (overhead and pumping) so we might be talking about different conditions here.

 

[waxfoot]

What would you define that upper range to be @kool-aid ?

Speaking of overlap, I love the use of the Venn diagram here;

 

[kool-aid]

I'd say 6' tops. I definitely have shortboards that go better in 7' - 8' surf than the shadow.

The board is just too fast IMO for anything bigger than 6' if there's any juice. I actually think this diagram is pretty accurate now that I look at it closer...

The phantom and shadow basically work in the same size wave range +/- 1 foot. The shadow is just higher performance.

 

[Maz]

Some Shadow advice, please.

Yesterday I had a dream day at my favourite wave. Had brought my trusty old 6'0 Pyzalien and 6'3 Ghost. Bigger sets were very solid OH, but a bit inco, so I chose the Pyzalien. It went great, but I could have gone Ghost too. But somewhere in that middle Goldilocks zone...

What I'm getting at is that instead of getting a new Pyzalien, I should probably just look after the old one really well and get a proper HPSB instead - the Shadow.

I'm 6'1 x 180, but I don't have a really wide stance, and usually don't like going too long - unless on semi guns. As Jon recommends your height or an inch more, 6'1 should be it. 6'1 x 19 1/2 x 2 5/8 should land me around 32.5L, which is the same as my Pyzalien. Or do I go 6'2?

What do you reckon?

 

[Aruka]

I went with my own height (6'3") on the Shadow. No regrets. With it's Ghost DNA it rides, not long exactly but definitely not short. Compared to other the many other 6'3"s I've owned it feels like it has a good amount of "effective" rail line, if that makes any sense.

 

[Maz]

Yep, that makes sense. Thanks.

Will start firming up the dims for an order.

 

[kool-aid]

I'd go 6'1 for sure. I'm 5'11.5 and I went 6'0 x 19.25 x 2.5 which are pretty much my standard shortboard dims. The board came in at 30.8L. I'm 185lbs without a wetsuit and the board feels great as an everyday HPSB.

One thing to note is that I asked for it to be glassed the same way they glass their team boards. The board is ultra-light. It seems like one 4oz on the bottom and one 4oz on top with a deck patch. The board dings and dents extremely easily but feel fantastic. I was certain it wouldn't make it through the season but low and behold it actually did. When I stripped the wax off, the deck actually wasn't in that bad of shape even if the nose and bottom look like they've seen better days.

 

[000]

salsa keeps the boards, then sells em. single 4oz deck...

 

[Maz]

Thanks guys

Would definitely get a beefier glass job than that, though. Too many rocks and sh!t here.

Re volume, I need a bit more, due to old age, long paddles, lots of water movement etc etc

 

[Aruka]

Your dims sound good Maz. Mine's 6'3" x 19 1/2" x 2 7/16". 31L and I was about 175lbs. when I got it. I'm more like 185 now and I wouldn't mind a little more thickness if I'm honest.