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Re: Paddle ability [Re: nightfly] #2896742
01/11/19 02:18 PM
01/11/19 02:18 PM
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Greg Griffin Offline
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Low entry angle into apex + nose kick creates a very efficient paddling area .


Re: Paddle ability [Re: GromsDad] #2896802
01/11/19 05:22 PM
01/11/19 05:22 PM
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Originally Posted By: GromsDad
Originally Posted By: surferx
Trying to design or buy a new board for Bigger east coast days. Post storm, strong offshore well OH hollow steep
Beach breaks with lots of water moving. Heavy full wetsuit. Daily board for lighter wetsuit and under head high is like 32 liters 5'11, 19.5x 2.44. Not cutting it on these bigger days. Current step up is too thin and has a narrow nose. Looking for something that above all, paddles and let's you into waves as early as possible before "air drops" or super late become necessary.
Torn between something short and thicker/wider for steep drops or something longer for trying to "get in early".
So what really makes a board an easier board to paddle? Length? Width? Or thickness? Will a shorter wider thicker board paddle better or as well as something longer and narrower? Or is length always needed for paddle ability?


Veteran of the conditions you describe. You don't want shorter wider thicker. You want a proper step up that fits you and your ability. When its really round there is no substitute for being good at taking off under the lip and taking your lumps. You want the volume but you want it hidden in a board that has a pulled in tail, plenty of rocker and a good hard edge on the bottom of the rail.

Last winter on a brutal cold snowy day with the waves pumping just like you describe a surfer I'd never seen before or since showed up at my home break. Guy was in his 60s. Guy paddled out and was getting barrelled off his ass on wave after wave. His board was an 8 foot narrow, rockered out Dick Brewer. My youngest son was out there in the same conditions killing it on a 5'2. Point is lots of boards will work but its got to fit the wave, your fitness and your ability. A couple of shots I grabbed of that Sr ripper. His board was perfect for his ability, fitness and conditions. Point is you have to start with a realistic assessment of your abilities and go from there. What works for a gifted teenager probably won't work for you and perhaps you don't need as much board as the guy pictured. I also recently got to watch one of the best tube riders on the planet surfing heavy beach break in a 5mm and his board was a 6'3x19x2.5 pintail step up. Perfect board for the conditions and his way of surfing. Kelly Slater payed a visit to my area last year and surfed similar conditions and was probably on a 5'2 or 5'4

One other thing I've noticed is that these days you will not find the right board on the racks here in NJ for our bigger days. You will find tons of boards for average days but if you want to surf big top to bottom waves on a proper step up the shops don't have them on the racks.





I never thought I'd say this, given our differences on the politics forum, but, "AMEN." cheers

Someone here said a 7-2 didn't fit the waves, but that really depends on how the 7-2 curves blend and... THE WAVE. My go to spot for larger waves (our beaches close out as it gets overhead...) is a fat, sloping wave. Good luck trying to get waves on a 6-2 out there roflmao

Also, to whoever said the 8-0 Brewer looks like you could chop a foot off...well maybe once you're on the wave, but maybe that foot is critical for the older guy to get in early with confidence. I know many times I wished I had a magical board that was 9 foot on take off and then morphed into a 6-0 once I was up and riding. It would be nice to have a 9-0 when paddling but magically morphs into a 6-0 x 18 when it came time to duck dive too.

I know I will get grief on the erBB for the mid length I'm making, given members propensity to inversely compare the length of their board with the length of their pepis...but some times when you get older you need a crutch or at least a cane...

Re: Paddle ability [Re: surferx] #2896880
01/11/19 08:12 PM
01/11/19 08:12 PM
Joined: Jul 2018
Posts: 100
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NinjaPete Offline
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I've been looking at getting something similar since this winter has been heavier than usual. My 6'10" semi-gun hasn't been enough for 15-20sec el nino swells. It's hard to find an 8'0 that isn't overly thick. I don't understand why shapers add thickness to the board when they go longer, unless it has something to do with structural integrity. You're gaining volume by going longer, which of course helps with buoyancy and reduces drag when paddling, but then they go and make it thicker adding more volume making my life difficult punching through waves. You want to maximize length to increase hull speed, more volume does not increase hull speed. You can have 4" thick 6' board, and it will be 2knots slower than a 2" thick 8' board, even though the 6' has more volume. Yet, off the shelf it's difficult to find an 8' less than 3" thick. I was hoping to find something used or from one of those pop out brands for cheaper than custom, but none of the dimensions really match what I'm looking for. By the time a custom is built, el nino will be over and I'll have a nice wall display for the next couple years until the next big winter shows up again.

Re: Paddle ability [Re: NinjaPete] #2896904
01/11/19 09:07 PM
01/11/19 09:07 PM
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Originally Posted By: NinjaPete
I've been looking at getting something similar since this winter has been heavier than usual. My 6'10" semi-gun hasn't been enough for 15-20sec el nino swells. It's hard to find an 8'0 that isn't overly thick. I don't understand why shapers add thickness to the board when they go longer, unless it has something to do with structural integrity. You're gaining volume by going longer, which of course helps with buoyancy and reduces drag when paddling, but then they go and make it thicker adding more volume making my life difficult punching through waves. You want to maximize length to increase hull speed, more volume does not increase hull speed. You can have 4" thick 6' board, and it will be 2knots slower than a 2" thick 8' board, even though the 6' has more volume. Yet, off the shelf it's difficult to find an 8' less than 3" thick. I was hoping to find something used or from one of those pop out brands for cheaper than custom, but none of the dimensions really match what I'm looking for. By the time a custom is built, el nino will be over and I'll have a nice wall display for the next couple years until the next big winter shows up again.


You'll never know until you try.



PS Time for a custom. Support your local shaper.

Re: Paddle ability [Re: patrolman] #2896907
01/11/19 09:32 PM
01/11/19 09:32 PM
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 20,078
West of the Atlantic. East of...
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Originally Posted By: patrolman
Originally Posted By: GromsDad
Originally Posted By: surferx
Trying to design or buy a new board for Bigger east coast days. Post storm, strong offshore well OH hollow steep
Beach breaks with lots of water moving. Heavy full wetsuit. Daily board for lighter wetsuit and under head high is like 32 liters 5'11, 19.5x 2.44. Not cutting it on these bigger days. Current step up is too thin and has a narrow nose. Looking for something that above all, paddles and let's you into waves as early as possible before "air drops" or super late become necessary.
Torn between something short and thicker/wider for steep drops or something longer for trying to "get in early".
So what really makes a board an easier board to paddle? Length? Width? Or thickness? Will a shorter wider thicker board paddle better or as well as something longer and narrower? Or is length always needed for paddle ability?


Veteran of the conditions you describe. You don't want shorter wider thicker. You want a proper step up that fits you and your ability. When its really round there is no substitute for being good at taking off under the lip and taking your lumps. You want the volume but you want it hidden in a board that has a pulled in tail, plenty of rocker and a good hard edge on the bottom of the rail.

Last winter on a brutal cold snowy day with the waves pumping just like you describe a surfer I'd never seen before or since showed up at my home break. Guy was in his 60s. Guy paddled out and was getting barrelled off his ass on wave after wave. His board was an 8 foot narrow, rockered out Dick Brewer. My youngest son was out there in the same conditions killing it on a 5'2. Point is lots of boards will work but its got to fit the wave, your fitness and your ability. A couple of shots I grabbed of that Sr ripper. His board was perfect for his ability, fitness and conditions. Point is you have to start with a realistic assessment of your abilities and go from there. What works for a gifted teenager probably won't work for you and perhaps you don't need as much board as the guy pictured. I also recently got to watch one of the best tube riders on the planet surfing heavy beach break in a 5mm and his board was a 6'3x19x2.5 pintail step up. Perfect board for the conditions and his way of surfing. Kelly Slater payed a visit to my area last year and surfed similar conditions and was probably on a 5'2 or 5'4

One other thing I've noticed is that these days you will not find the right board on the racks here in NJ for our bigger days. You will find tons of boards for average days but if you want to surf big top to bottom waves on a proper step up the shops don't have them on the racks.





I never thought I'd say this, given our differences on the politics forum, but, "AMEN." cheers

Someone here said a 7-2 didn't fit the waves, but that really depends on how the 7-2 curves blend and... THE WAVE. My go to spot for larger waves (our beaches close out as it gets overhead...) is a fat, sloping wave. Good luck trying to get waves on a 6-2 out there roflmao

Also, to whoever said the 8-0 Brewer looks like you could chop a foot off...well maybe once you're on the wave, but maybe that foot is critical for the older guy to get in early with confidence. I know many times I wished I had a magical board that was 9 foot on take off and then morphed into a 6-0 once I was up and riding. It would be nice to have a 9-0 when paddling but magically morphs into a 6-0 x 18 when it came time to duck dive too.

I know I will get grief on the erBB for the mid length I'm making, given members propensity to inversely compare the length of their board with the length of their pepis...but some times when you get older you need a crutch or at least a cane...


To the guy knocking the 60+ year old man riding an 8-0 Brewer in overhead hollow waves as too much board: I sincerely hope that age 60 you can stand on any form of a surfboard at all, let alone a shortboard, or even better yet, paddling out in overhead hollow waves after a snow storm when its 25 degrees with water in the upper 30s and a wind chill in the single digits and being able to rip on any form of a board let alone an 8-0 Brewer. Most and likely you won't. Most are stuck surfing waist high mush on a log at that age. That guy was ripping as far as I'm concerned. I hope I last that long. I just looked back at the date of those pictures and it was January 13th of last year right before dark in NJ. It was freaking cooooold.


What's the difference between conservatives and liberals?

Conservatives get angry when you lie to them. Liberals get angry when you tell
them the truth.
Re: Paddle ability [Re: patrolman] #2896917
01/11/19 10:34 PM
01/11/19 10:34 PM
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That was me, it 7'2" Merrick made for indo. The real big days(short period swells) where I surf are not a glide in situation, you have to take off pretty much under the lip and the extra length seemed catch quite often.

Re: Paddle ability [Re: surferx] #2896926
01/11/19 11:12 PM
01/11/19 11:12 PM
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To me it was most important to have a board with a drawn in tail and thin rails and a sharp edge on the rails. Its key to be able to knife a takeoff. You're not going to glide in but if you can knife it at an angle you've got more margin for error than if you are on a board where your only option is late and under the lip. My favorite board for winter barrels was a 6'8 x 19.5 x 2.5 John Carper similar to the one pictured. Working hard to get back to where I can think of needing a board like this again.



What's the difference between conservatives and liberals?

Conservatives get angry when you lie to them. Liberals get angry when you tell
them the truth.
Re: Paddle ability [Re: surferx] #2896964
01/12/19 12:03 AM
01/12/19 12:03 AM
Joined: Oct 2015
Posts: 411
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If you have a stretch 2x4 laying around one of your local shops, you may want to look at what he does with the nose. Lowered entry rocker, but the top 1/4 of the board hull shape is reminiscent of a super-flat version of a prone paddle board - super-efficient distribution/displacement guiding of water without letting the nose catch. Thing paddles extremely well, wide pt ever so slightly forward.

You may want a bit more rocker in the tail for your waves, but the 2x4 does it with a double concave out the back. check one out if you get the chance.

Re: Paddle ability [Re: surferx] #2896983
01/12/19 12:38 AM
01/12/19 12:38 AM
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NJ
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Forgive me for bringing the Coil love to this thread, but I went to Mike Daniel describing this very scenario and he made me a 6'6"x19.5x2.5" Qualifier @1.15ft3 with low rails and the Hawaii glassing schedule and it fit the bill perfectly (best step-up I've ever ridden). I plan to re-order the same board in more man-sized dims as my age and walking weight is a bit more (from 180ish to 200ish).

PS- the dude on the brewer is my goal- hoping to be doing the same in 20 years and those photos and GromsDad's testimony makes me think it might just be possible. If I have to ride an 8' to make it happen, so be it with no apologies.


Sorry I'm late... there was trouble at the lab with the running and the exploding and the crying...
Re: Paddle ability [Re: hackeysaky] #2897127
01/12/19 11:48 AM
01/12/19 11:48 AM
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Originally Posted By: hackeysaky
Forgive me for bringing the Coil love to this thread,


Sorry but that is unforgivable. Don't you guys have a 437 page thread somewhere to promote those things?


What's the difference between conservatives and liberals?

Conservatives get angry when you lie to them. Liberals get angry when you tell
them the truth.
Re: Paddle ability [Re: surferx] #2897134
01/12/19 12:25 PM
01/12/19 12:25 PM
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Palm Coast , Florida
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Again this is what makes a board paddle well :


Re: Paddle ability [Re: surferx] #2897137
01/12/19 12:52 PM
01/12/19 12:52 PM
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A brick mounted under your chest?


What's the difference between conservatives and liberals?

Conservatives get angry when you lie to them. Liberals get angry when you tell
them the truth.
Re: Paddle ability [Re: GromsDad] #2897145
01/12/19 02:12 PM
01/12/19 02:12 PM
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NJ
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Originally Posted By: GromsDad
Originally Posted By: hackeysaky
Forgive me for bringing the Coil love to this thread,


Sorry but that is unforgivable. Don't you guys have a 437 page thread somewhere to promote those things?


Fake news. It's 245 pages. My post 'twas really more a testimony for the shaper/custom board process; the board is dialed in for the conditions described.

Does Stretch get a pass? The "stretch boards support and board pron thread" is going strong at 195 pages.


Sorry I'm late... there was trouble at the lab with the running and the exploding and the crying...
Re: Paddle ability [Re: surferx] #2897158
01/12/19 03:07 PM
01/12/19 03:07 PM
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As I said, use what works and gets you in the water especially on cold, gnarly days.

I'm 47 and surf conditions like that in NY all winter. I hope to be doing it when I'm 60.

I'm just saying that those type of designs with long, skinny, non-functional noses, look very dated now after riding shorter wider boards.

You could probably get the same volume and functionality from something shorter which would fit the wave better.

I think for longer period, open ocean swells on outer reefs etc or places like Ocean Beach, an extra long board makes sense, I just think in short period hucking beach break, there are better solutions. But again whatever works.

In another thread I think someone posted these Patagina F-Rockets, which are sort of an eggy step up which is the direction I think I'd go as I age and need some more paddle and glide.

Last edited by nightfly; 01/12/19 03:28 PM.
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