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Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: hal9000] #2892844
01/01/19 05:36 PM
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Originally Posted By: hal9000
I'll believe what ifall and Duffy are saying when it becomes the norm for elite athletes to train this way. For now, I'm writing this low carb thing off as a fitness trend.


Again, I think you are not understanding the separation between nutrition and fueling.

It is rapidly becaoming the norm for elite athletes to follow a low carb nutrition plan.

And as I have stated here already a few times, during training and competition output they are fueling with carbs (but the carb intake needs are less for the athletes who follow a low carb nutrition plan).

I think once you actually understand what Im saying (and what the science is saying) youll come around.

For the record, a strict keto diet isnt really something thats sustainable long term and very few people (nobody really) follows strict keto all the time.

Personally Ive never done any kind of diet. I just dont eat very many carbs and since I got more consistent about it Ive gone from 205lbs. (14 months ago) to 180 today (and Ive been at 180 for that last 4 months).

That aint water weight.

When I cut for fights I cut down to 169 and thats all water.

I rarely train for over 2 hours these days so fueling during runs/bikes, etc. isnt necessary, in part because I eat a low carb diet. When I ate a high carb diet I couldnt run for more than an hour without needing fuel. Now its two hours.


�No eternal reward will forgive us now for wasting the dawn�

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Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: ifallalot] #2892847
01/01/19 05:56 PM
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Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
I'll believe what ifall and Duffy are saying when it becomes the norm for elite athletes to train this way. For now, I'm writing this low carb thing off as a fitness trend.

All of the pro athletes I know limit their carbs to a number that would be considered severely limiting them by SAD standards. This is year-round

The days of carb-loading before competition are over, but then again, I don't hang out with cyclists. However, when I was swimming a lot the people I trained with who did triathlons ever didn't eat a lot of carbs on a daily basis.



Anecdotes are not the same as science. Beware sample size.

Last edited by hal9000; 01/01/19 05:57 PM.

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Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: hal9000] #2892855
01/01/19 06:14 PM
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Originally Posted By: hal9000
Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
I'll believe what ifall and Duffy are saying when it becomes the norm for elite athletes to train this way. For now, I'm writing this low carb thing off as a fitness trend.

All of the pro athletes I know limit their carbs to a number that would be considered severely limiting them by SAD standards. This is year-round

The days of carb-loading before competition are over, but then again, I don't hang out with cyclists. However, when I was swimming a lot the people I trained with who did triathlons ever didn't eat a lot of carbs on a daily basis.



Anecdotes are not the same as science. Beware sample size.

Aren't elite athletes by definition a small enough sample size for all evidence involving them to be anecdotal?


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Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: hal9000] #2892856
01/01/19 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted By: hal9000
Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
I'll believe what ifall and Duffy are saying when it becomes the norm for elite athletes to train this way. For now, I'm writing this low carb thing off as a fitness trend.

All of the pro athletes I know limit their carbs to a number that would be considered severely limiting them by SAD standards. This is year-round

The days of carb-loading before competition are over, but then again, I don't hang out with cyclists. However, when I was swimming a lot the people I trained with who did triathlons ever didn't eat a lot of carbs on a daily basis.



Anecdotes are not the same as science. Beware sample size.


https://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2015/11/151117091234.htm


�No eternal reward will forgive us now for wasting the dawn�

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Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: ifallalot] #2892862
01/01/19 06:36 PM
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Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
Originally Posted By: FecalFace
So when they're training they're not consuming carbs? Only when racing? roflmao

If they are consuming carbs while training (they are) and during race, how is that a low carb diet? They train/race year round. foreheadslap

Here you go, cauliflower ears:

To fuel the journey riders need to consume an average of 5,000-plus calories per stage. Maintaining such a huge energy intake is challenging, says Corinne Mder, senior sports nutritionist at PowerBar, official sports nutrition partners of the Tour de France for over a decade.

Read more at https://www.cyclingweekly.com/news/racin...lowTSgtjPuCh.99




I'll hypothesize that, at some point, you run up against biophysics. There are limits to everything. The speed at which your body metabolizes fat is likely not fast enough to keep up with cellular ATP demand. If your cells can't produce metabolites to fuel oxidative phosphorylation, you'll likely: gas out or experience failure, start tapping into glycogen stores, start breaking down muscle tissue, or probably a dozen other possibilities I haven't thought of.

Long story short, elite athletes need carbs.

When in the training process? During competition or before?

These elite athletes are near-starvation the day before competition.





MMA fighting takes place over five 5 minute rounds with 1 minute breaks between each round.

25 minutes with breaks is not an endurance activity. Dummy.

Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: FecalFace] #2892863
01/01/19 06:40 PM
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That's the competition. The training is harder than any other sport


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Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: ifallalot] #2892864
01/01/19 06:43 PM
01/01/19 06:43 PM
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Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
I'll believe what ifall and Duffy are saying when it becomes the norm for elite athletes to train this way. For now, I'm writing this low carb thing off as a fitness trend.

All of the pro athletes I know limit their carbs to a number that would be considered severely limiting them by SAD standards. This is year-round

The days of carb-loading before competition are over, but then again, I don't hang out with cyclists. However, when I was swimming a lot the people I trained with who did triathlons ever didn't eat a lot of carbs on a daily basis.



Anecdotes are not the same as science. Beware sample size.

Aren't elite athletes by definition a small enough sample size for all evidence involving them to be anecdotal?




Yes.

I couldn't imagine cycling a mountain phase without eating carbs during.

I enjoy morning fasted workouts. Not for any particular reason than my head just seems clear and I'm ready to go. Always eat carbs afterwards. Usually one cup of oatmeal, then it's a protein heavy day with most of my carbs at dinner, especially on days where I feel physical fatigue.

If you're an active adult you're not getting enough protein anyway. As you age your body is less adept at protein synthesis. Limiting complete proteins intake is not good for the aging phenotype and there's generally no way for men over 40 to get enough from food. The body is really good at taking what you give it and making things work....but why make things tough on yourself. You're going to pay for it later. Whey protein is a cheap and easy supplement.


Originally Posted By: StuAzole
The deference given to veterans is insane. They signed up, did their job and got paid for it. Fine.
Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: ifallalot] #2892867
01/01/19 06:48 PM
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Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
I'll believe what ifall and Duffy are saying when it becomes the norm for elite athletes to train this way. For now, I'm writing this low carb thing off as a fitness trend.

All of the pro athletes I know limit their carbs to a number that would be considered severely limiting them by SAD standards. This is year-round

The days of carb-loading before competition are over, but then again, I don't hang out with cyclists. However, when I was swimming a lot the people I trained with who did triathlons ever didn't eat a lot of carbs on a daily basis.



Anecdotes are not the same as science. Beware sample size.

Aren't elite athletes by definition a small enough sample size for all evidence involving them to be anecdotal?






You don't have to be an elite athlete to run/swim/ride long distances.

All of which you're fvcked if you don't consume carbs.

You have to know your feeding and hydrating strategy. Eating keto ain't it.

If I go on a ride that's longer than 2 hours, I know I need to bring a gel or two or risk being stranded in the middle of nowhere in a hypoglycemic state.

If you ever experienced it, you never do that mistake again.




Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: FecalFace] #2892870
01/01/19 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted By: FecalFace
Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
I'll believe what ifall and Duffy are saying when it becomes the norm for elite athletes to train this way. For now, I'm writing this low carb thing off as a fitness trend.

All of the pro athletes I know limit their carbs to a number that would be considered severely limiting them by SAD standards. This is year-round

The days of carb-loading before competition are over, but then again, I don't hang out with cyclists. However, when I was swimming a lot the people I trained with who did triathlons ever didn't eat a lot of carbs on a daily basis.



Anecdotes are not the same as science. Beware sample size.

Aren't elite athletes by definition a small enough sample size for all evidence involving them to be anecdotal?






You don't have to be an elite athlete to run/swim/ride long distances.

All of which you're fvcked if you don't consume carbs.

Feeding and hydrating strategy is the most important thing in these activities.

If I go on a ride that's longer than 2 hours, I know I need to bring a gel or two or risk being stranded in the middle of nowhere in a hypoglycemic state.

If you ever experienced it, you never do that mistake again.




That's because your body is used to eating carbs.

I've done multiple distance swim competitions (2-3 miles) and I don't consume anything besides water competing.


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Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: ifallalot] #2892871
01/01/19 06:53 PM
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Originally Posted By: ifallalot
That's the competition. The training is harder than any other sport


Uh no and no.

You're training for sprint, not a marathon. Carbs not required.

Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: ifallalot] #2892872
01/01/19 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: FecalFace
Originally Posted By: ifallalot
Originally Posted By: hal9000
Originally Posted By: ifallalot

All of the pro athletes I know limit their carbs to a number that would be considered severely limiting them by SAD standards. This is year-round

The days of carb-loading before competition are over, but then again, I don't hang out with cyclists. However, when I was swimming a lot the people I trained with who did triathlons ever didn't eat a lot of carbs on a daily basis.



Anecdotes are not the same as science. Beware sample size.

Aren't elite athletes by definition a small enough sample size for all evidence involving them to be anecdotal?






You don't have to be an elite athlete to run/swim/ride long distances.

All of which you're fvcked if you don't consume carbs.

Feeding and hydrating strategy is the most important thing in these activities.

If I go on a ride that's longer than 2 hours, I know I need to bring a gel or two or risk being stranded in the middle of nowhere in a hypoglycemic state.

If you ever experienced it, you never do that mistake again.




That's because your body is used to eating carbs.

I've done multiple distance swim competitions (2-3 miles) and I don't consume anything besides water competing.


roflmao

You are confused.

Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: FecalFace] #2892892
01/01/19 08:03 PM
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Oh I am? Long distance open water swims are short compared to runs or cycling. Long distance pool swims are only 1000-1500m / 1000-1650yds

Unless you're talking about marathon swimming, which is the equivalent of ultramarathons when running.

There's a reason why the Ironman swim is only a paltry 1.2 mile swim.


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Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: ifallalot] #2892902
01/01/19 08:20 PM
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Personally I think including high level road weenies in any discussion re athleticism is funnier than shit. One trick ponies. Kill you on a climb/drop you, yeah, but get them off a bike and they're not good for much.

Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: hal9000] #2892907
01/01/19 08:33 PM
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i don't drink coffee (or any caffeine) anymore. just thought i'd add that here.

Re: Can we talk about the keto diet? [Re: obslop] #2892912
01/01/19 08:52 PM
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Originally Posted By: obslop
i don't drink coffee (or any caffeine) anymore. just thought i'd add that here.

Was it hard to quit?


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