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Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: bergie] #2197615
05/02/14 08:14 PM
05/02/14 08:14 PM
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I've had (probably still have) compressed discs and pinched nerves up and down my spine (not to mention the broken back). I thought I was going to live the rest of my life with neck and back pain. However, once diagnosed, I started some rehab/physical therapy to strengthen muscles, including core. Amazingly, it has backed off significantly (not totally disappeared).

Staying active doesn't mean placing yourself in the position of getting an extreme trauma (skateboarding). Swim or do some yoga. But see a doctor first. That's my recommendation.

Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: bergie] #2197775
05/03/14 02:36 AM
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Just met with new pt but this one use diferent approach and heard only good thing about her form people with SERIOUS long time pain and got better right away by using mental brain thing as well so ill give it a shot and planning to get back surfing in 2 weeks after a few days of swimming and biking gotta get back into it

Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: bergie] #2197820
05/03/14 06:20 AM
05/03/14 06:20 AM
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THE TERRORIST OF TERRAMAR
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Originally Posted By: bergie
Just met with new pt but this one use diferent approach and heard only good thing about her form people with SERIOUS long time pain and got better right away by using mental brain thing as well so ill give it a shot and planning to get back surfing in 2 weeks after a few days of swimming and biking gotta get back into it


No worries. You'll be doing zoomba in no time.


Originally Posted By: StuAzole
The deference given to veterans is insane. They signed up, did their job and got paid for it. Fine.
Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: bergie] #2197884
05/03/14 05:33 PM
05/03/14 05:33 PM
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timely thread for me-my back went out in late January and I haven't surfed since. Mid fifties and have had back problems for 30 years. I had an mri recently and have two ruptured discs. Doc said swim, but don't surf. He said it will likely heal itself, but will take a while. I've been swimming the laps three-four times a week. Missed so many great days of surf the last four months......I'll probably read the book. I was also thinking those inversion chair things that put you upside down might help. Anyone ever try that?

Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: waxhead] #2197889
05/03/14 05:47 PM
05/03/14 05:47 PM
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Originally Posted By: waxhead
......I'll probably read the book. I was also thinking those inversion chair things that put you upside down might help. Anyone ever try that?


1 - 'probably' is no way to read the book. you gotta read it positively
2 - hanging upside down's weird, but if you're into drainer and his wife, they might be able to work you over in that chair and make you forget all about the pain in your back
cowabunga
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Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: bergie] #2197892
05/03/14 05:54 PM
05/03/14 05:54 PM
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The moral of the story is you could have herniated disks and they are not causing the pain.

Correlation does not imply causation.

Or you could have them and they are causing pain.

Correlation does imply causation.

If it is the first option and you get back surgery you have made a huge mistake.

This seems to be pretty common knowledge now.

A conservative approach seems the best approach.


incompetence is preferable to malice.
Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: Random Guy] #2197899
05/03/14 06:12 PM
05/03/14 06:12 PM
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Originally Posted By: Random Guy
Originally Posted By: waxhead
......I'll probably read the book. I was also thinking those inversion chair things that put you upside down might help. Anyone ever try that?


1 - 'probably' is no way to read the book. you gotta read it positively
2 - hanging upside down's weird, but if you're into drainer and his wife, they might be able to work you over in that chair and make you forget all about the pain in your back
cowabunga
rg
dancing cheers monkey

Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: Coat Hanger] #2197930
05/03/14 09:04 PM
05/03/14 09:04 PM
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"interestingly i just don't see people in e. asia (for example) with back problems"

actually an accurate observation that is true. And why?
because from infants they have sat cross legged on the ground instead of on a chair, so they have significantly more flexibility in their hips, which basically unloads the back. It's why they can spend decades bent over working the rice fields and never have back issues.
Trace your heritage. Genetics matter. got north European in your ancestry? due to adaptive body changes because your ancestors spent hundreds of generations on a horse, common issue are non inflexible hips due to the elevated pelvic saddle locking out T4/T5 = more of a load along less discs = back issues.
One of the best things you can do to unload your hips/back are hamstring stretches.
safest hamstring stretch is the doorway stretch- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YJ9MjdWC2aE

Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: Random Guy] #2197940
05/03/14 09:37 PM
05/03/14 09:37 PM
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Right - I don't post much - mainly lurk - but thought I'd give you the benefit of telling you what worked for me.
A brief history: About 10 years ago I first put my back out doing deadlifts (with poor technique) in the gym. I felt it go, was on my back for about a week, saw an Osteopath it got better, but after that about every 12 - 18 months or so it would "go" (doing a whole range of things from simply bending down to getting off a bike) and I'd be disabled for about a week. I'd see an osteopath - he'd tell me I was sitting down too much, sitting incorrectly, would give me a load of exercises to do - which I'd do for about a week or two, my back would get better and then I'd go back to how I was. I also had read the magical book - but it didn't seem to stop it from happening.
About a year ago however that changed. My back went - I did the usual lying down for a few days and visiting an osteopath. But it didn't fix it. I ended up seeing all sorts of different people, chiropractors, even Bowen therapy (what a crock of poop that is). I bought foam rollers, I bought a gravity table for hanging upside-down (I would have paid any amount of money to be free from the pain) but nothing helped. I started to get really depressed as I simply couldn't do any form of exercise etc. Eventually I noticed my foot wasn't working properly (a condition called foot drop) so I went to my Dr. He ordered me an X-ray and then an MRI scan. Turns out I had a compression fracture in a vertebrae L3 (from the X-ray) and a ruptured/bulging disc L5/S1. About this time I was recommended a really good sports physiotherapist who was also trained in a technique called Rolfing - which is all about body alignment. I was desperate at this point so booked an appointment and went along to see him.
Practically the second I stepped into his office he said "I can pretty much tell what's wrong with you without doing any form of investigation/diagnosis - but we'll do it anyway to be thorough". So he had me strip down, had a look at me moved me about looked at my legs and hips, measured my legs. Then gave me his diagnosis.
He said "you're a lock knee standing desk shagger". Transpires I stand with my knees locked (very bad apparently) with all my weight on one leg (making it appear that I have one leg longer than the other - which I don't) and stand with my hips thrust forward (That's the desk shagging bit). He said it's all to do with the muscles in your hips and buttocks being very tight and locked - and this is what's causing all your problems - the back pain is a symptom of this underlying problem.
So he set to work on easing off my Psoas muscle - which is deep in your hips and runs from your spine to the front of your groin and working on easing all the other muscles in my hips and buttocks. After the first session I was a new man - by that evening my foot was functioning again and by the next day my back pain had pretty much gone. I went to see him two more times - after which he said - buy yourself one of these massagers (A Thumper Mini Pro 2) and use it on yourself everyday (hips and buttocks) or whenever you feel things getting tight and come back if you ever have another problem - which you shouldn't.
I have to say - after about 5 months I've been much more mobile and free from back pain than ever before in my life (since the first event) and that massager is probably the best 180 I've ever spent in my life.
So find yourself someone who understands physiotherapy very well, who understands how to manipulate the Psoas muscle (this part is very important) - they could be a Rolfer but make sure there also a physio too and buy yourself a Thumper Mini Pro 2 - and within a couple of weeks you should be good to go. Good luck and try not to let it get you too depressed.

Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: Mr C] #2198162
05/04/14 10:34 PM
05/04/14 10:34 PM
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Hey Mr C

Thanks for your post, very interesting.

Where in UK you based? I'm in Aberdeen, Scotland, and am looking at a new physio. Back history seems similar to yours. Intermittent episodes for years, did exercises and work on it after each episode until things cleared up, then would stop doing exercises. Then two years ago my back went out while doing squats in gym, and pretty much hasn't gotten better since then. Now I've got nerve symptoms in both legs and one foot, besides the constant pain. Just sold two of my three boards cos I can't get in the water any more. Woe is me pacifier

I'll google the Rolfing technique you mention, but I'm just checking on the off chance you're not up in these parts. I might contact your physio's office and ask him to recommend someone closer to me if you're down south.

Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: bergie] #2198451
05/05/14 10:19 PM
05/05/14 10:19 PM
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Good take on Sarno's book here:

Quote:
Conclusion

In sum, Sarno is correct that the brain and emotional stress play a big role in chronic pain, but his proposed mechanism for how this relationship works appears implausible and inconsistent with what we know about pain science and evolution.

Of course, none of this means that his treatments do not work. That is a separate question! So if Sarnos methods work for you, that is great, congrats on your progress and keep at it. But dont think that proves that TMS is a real disease, or that Sarnos methods work by curing it.


http://www.bettermovement.org/2011/a-skeptical-look-at-the-theories-of-dr-john-sarno/


Assholier than thou.
Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: bergie] #2198466
05/05/14 10:42 PM
05/05/14 10:42 PM
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I'm tripping out on Dorko's "Gentle Touch."

I was trying it out my girl friend yesterday.

She thought I was trying F her.


incompetence is preferable to malice.
Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: Autoprax] #2198468
05/05/14 10:50 PM
05/05/14 10:50 PM
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Originally Posted By: Autoprax
I'm tripping out on dorko's gentle touch.

I was trying it out my girl friend yesterday.

She thought I was trying F her.


The term "The grooming Lorax" also came to mind reading your posts to Shayla...

shameonyou roflmao


He was just in CA a couple of months ago, did you go to the conference?



I'll be at this one:
http://www.sandiegopainsummit.com/

Quote:
Speakers
KEYNOTE SPEAKER - LORIMER MOSELEY, PhD
BARRETT DORKO, PT
CHRISTOPHER A. MOYER, PhD
CORY BLICKENSTAFF, PT, MS, OCS
DIANE JACOBS, PT
ERIC KRUGER, DPT
JASON SILVERNAIL, DPT, DSc, FAAOMPT
JOE BRENCE, DPT, FAAOMPT, COMT, DAC
JOHN WARE, PT, MS, FAAOMPTS
KARA BARNETT, MPT, OCS
NEIL PEARSON, MSc, BScPT, CYT, RYT500


Assholier than thou.
Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: bergie] #2198474
05/05/14 11:03 PM
05/05/14 11:03 PM
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No, I was watching his videos but now I can't find them.

What is weird is that I was just thinking (in the last few months) that your body has this intelligent communication system that our egos are not fluent in understanding because we are so language dominant in our communication.

Cats don't have written symbolic language getting in the way of the body's communication with the conscious self.

Our body tells us stuff but we are like, "no entiendo."

He seems like he is trying to get you communicating with your body's non-verbal communication. "Tuned in" if you like hippie talk.

I did it the gentle touch and the girl friend rotated left and felt the warming in her arm. That is cool poop because I don't even know what I am doing.

So I'm in.

Shayla?

Do you need a gentle touch?

Maybe you will take better pictures?


incompetence is preferable to malice.
Re: herniated disc tips to get back faster in the water [Re: obelix] #2199377
05/07/14 08:06 PM
05/07/14 08:06 PM
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Hi Obelix,

Sorry for the delayed reply - travelling at the moment in France.
First thing to mention is that once you start getting nerve issues (i.e. not being able to raise your foot etc) you need to get it sorted asap. You can cause permanent damage to the nerves if you don't get it fixed within 6 months. You definitely need to see a Dr (if you haven't already) and if you do have nerve issues they will do an X-ray first (you have to have an x-ray before an MRI with the NHS) and then send you for an MRI.

As for my location - I'm afraid I'm down in the South West in Devon. The chap I went to see is called Richard Pannell and is based in Plymouth - if you google him you'll find his website. If you can't find anyone local that seems to offer what you want maybe you could give him a call and see if he can recommend anyone in your area. Richard himself isn't a qualified Rolfer - but the lady that works there called Jaqueline is and they both treated me (sometimes both at the same time!) What I found was that actually Richard was better at the treatments as I'm fairly muscular and heavy so I think it was easier for someone stronger to manipulate my muscles. He was actually pretty brutal with his manipulation and whilst it hurt at the time, you kind of knew it was doing you good - so (without being sexist) I'd go for a man over a woman for this type of work every time.

Knowing what I know now my advice would be that when you phone (whoever you think might be able to help) for an appointment ask them specifically if they manipulate the Psoas (pronounced "so ass") muscle. If they say no - or if they say it's not possible (which a lot of people think is the case - including most Dr's) then you've not found the right person. You need to find someone that understands and will manipulate the Psoas muscle (just to warn you that involves a lot of poking and pressing in your groin).

Good luck and I hope you can find someone local to you. If not get yourself a train ticket down to Plymouth have a week or so down there and go and see Richard a few times - obviously I can't guarantee you success but he's the only person I've ever met who actually seemed to know what he was on about and the results backed up everything he said. Oh and don't give up and definitely don't even consider surgery until you've seen Richard (the pain can do funny things to your mind).

Cheers,

Mr C

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