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#2629194 - 04/20/17 10:41 PM Re: Hire American [Re: GDaddy]
BillyOcean Offline
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Registered: 01/06/17
Posts: 731
Originally Posted By: GDaddy
"lack of skilled workers" is a presumption to be proven, not an assumption to be taken at face value. Just because an employer *says* they can't find workers with the skills they need doesn't always mean it's true that those workers don't exist at any price.

The tech workers at Disney who had to train the imported H1b workers who took over their jobs were obviously not part of this "lack of skilled workers" dilemma. They were just too experienced and too expensive to keep their jobs. And hey, at Disney it wasn't enough to simply bring in younger workers, they had to bring in foreign nationals despite the point that there are all kinds of private schools in the U.S. turning out tech educated workers, particularly in the media arts.

https://www.nytimes.com/2016/01/26/us/la...immigrants.html

Not. In. Evidence.

What allegedly happened at Disney was that it was a "lack of skilled workers who would work for less", which is something entirely different. If the workers Disney hired were somehow better then why did the victims have to train their replacements prior to getting tossed?



And this is just one example

This shit happens all the time

This is why companies are freaking over the proposal that they have to use h1bs to hire workers who are above standard wages

Because that is exactly the OPPOSITE of how it is used today

Now imagine if we just banned immigration altogether

Would all of these companies just close up shop?

Or maybe they would just adjust and pay Americans what they are really worth

People all over the western world are fed up with being undercut by their own governments

If a company wants the benefit of a third world labor force, they are free to relocate to their preferred third world shithole

But you don't get to bring the third world here and keep all of the benefits and absorb none of the social costs

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#2629200 - 04/20/17 10:51 PM Re: Hire American [Re: BillyOcean]
sizzld1 Offline
Michael Peterson status
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Registered: 03/31/09
Posts: 2029
Loc: Where the wild things roam...
Even if your base assumptions, for which you've provided only the barest of anecdotal evidence, are true, how do you think your "plan" would impact the economy? I'm thinking maybe not so good. Legal immigration for "highly skilled" international workers (that is what H1B visas are for incase you forgot) is the least of this country's problems. trout
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#2629213 - 04/20/17 11:30 PM Re: Hire American [Re: BillyOcean]
hammies Offline
Billy Hamilton status
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Registered: 04/08/06
Posts: 1715
H1B abuses are a distraction. Yeah, they happen, but as a national problem they are down in the weeds. Besides, there are a lot of H1B successes for every disaster.

The big thing is millions of American workers being displaced by automation. Modern manufacturing is happening, but it uses only 1/10th the workforce and they are all highly trained engineers and technicians. No politician is willing to speak the truth about this and be willing to lay down the big bucks to significantly upgrade the skillsets of our current blue-collar workforce, who ends up getting screwed. The Dems long ago kicked out the blue collar scrubs and the Repubs just bait them with blaming immigrants for everything bad.
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#2629224 - 04/21/17 12:06 AM Re: Hire American [Re: BillyOcean]
manbearpig Offline
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Registered: 05/11/09
Posts: 5132
Loc: its so flat
Hammie, I 100% agree. The automated deal isn't as good as it may seem. Our advances in technology like that are great but we're not doing anything to protect those whose jobs will be replaced by the automation. Those advances in technology will hurt the middle and below class, a much more permanent danger to those groups in my opinion.
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#2629260 - 04/21/17 06:52 AM Re: Hire American [Re: BillyOcean]
BillyOcean Offline
Nep status
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Registered: 01/06/17
Posts: 731
H1b is not a distraction

It's a symbol of how corrupt our government is

People with influence can manipulate the system to f over average Americans who play by the rules

just like the wall killing h1b is more than just the thing itself

It is a signal that we are now putting actual Americans first in the order of priority

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#2629261 - 04/21/17 06:57 AM Re: Hire American [Re: BillyOcean]
BillyOcean Offline
Nep status
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Registered: 01/06/17
Posts: 731
By the way, people say the same thing about a lot of things that f over non elite white people

"Affirmative action isn't a big deal. It only affects a tiny percentage of people at best."

"Illegal immigration isn't a big deal. It's a net positive for the overall economy."

"H1bs aren't a big deal. Small potatoes "

Notice a pattern?

It all adds up to a perception (which is true) that downscale whites are supposed to bear any cost of any social engineering scheme dreamed up by the aristocracy and smile

Well those days are over

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#2629278 - 04/21/17 10:24 AM Re: Hire American [Re: manbearpig]
GDaddy Offline
Duke status
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Registered: 01/16/06
Posts: 16177
Loc: Carlsbad
Originally Posted By: manbearpig
Hammie, I 100% agree. The automated deal isn't as good as it may seem. Our advances in technology like that are great but we're not doing anything to protect those whose jobs will be replaced by the automation. Those advances in technology will hurt the middle and below class, a much more permanent danger to those groups in my opinion.


Okay, but the onset of technology is inevitable and outside our normal controls, whereas immigration policies most definitely are not outside our control and discretion. Just because one of those problems can be perceived to be bigger than the other doesn't justify blowing that smaller problem off entirely. If the combined H1B quota is 85,000 workers and (let's guess) 75,000 of them are in the tech fields that's going to leave a mark in that segment of the employment market in which they are competing. Which is a much smaller subset than the 155M worker workforce in the U.S.


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#2629323 - 04/21/17 12:48 PM Re: Hire American [Re: GDaddy]
ifallalot Online   sick
Duke status
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Registered: 12/17/08
Posts: 40488
Loc: HB, CA
Originally Posted By: GDaddy
Originally Posted By: manbearpig
Hammie, I 100% agree. The automated deal isn't as good as it may seem. Our advances in technology like that are great but we're not doing anything to protect those whose jobs will be replaced by the automation. Those advances in technology will hurt the middle and below class, a much more permanent danger to those groups in my opinion.


Okay, but the onset of technology is inevitable and outside our normal controls, whereas immigration policies most definitely are not outside our control and discretion. Just because one of those problems can be perceived to be bigger than the other doesn't justify blowing that smaller problem off entirely. If the combined H1B quota is 85,000 workers and (let's guess) 75,000 of them are in the tech fields that's going to leave a mark in that segment of the employment market in which they are competing. Which is a much smaller subset than the 155M worker workforce in the U.S.


That's 75,000 jobs that aren't going to Americans
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#2629333 - 04/21/17 01:03 PM Re: Hire American [Re: ifallalot]
surfrog Offline
Grom
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Registered: 04/19/17
Posts: 10
Loc: Oceanslide, CA
What do you expect from generation snowflake? All these kids getting liberal arts degrees don't understand the hard work that goes into slinging condos on the erbb. They need trigger warnings for their fragile egos.

Nevermind the fact that they spend all day worrying about the "Global Warming" boogyman. That's what they are teaching in school these days. It was nice and warm out today, must be because of global warming though! roflmao

Let me know when the polar ice caps start melting hah

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#2629347 - 04/21/17 01:35 PM Re: Hire American [Re: BillyOcean]
rts265 Online   content
Michael Peterson status
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Registered: 10/19/07
Posts: 1937
lol

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#2629356 - 04/21/17 02:00 PM Re: Hire American [Re: surfrog]
Surfdog Offline
Tom Curren status
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Registered: 04/22/01
Posts: 10910
Loc: Oceanside,CA
a Iittle better, grasshopper.
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